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Old 11-27-2018, 10:22 AM   #1
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Inspection Results On A '93 Carpenter B700

Good morning,
My husband & I need a little guidance. We have put down a deposit on a '93 Carpenter B700 bus. Engine is a 5.9 Cummins Turbo Diesel & transmission is an Alison AT545. Seats have been removed & bus has been painted the color we want. Over all the bus is exactly what we're looking for.

We hired an inspector & the results are an oil leak & 1 cracked tire as our main concerns. The current bus owner is selling it for $5,250. With the above results, how much should we negotiate price? Knowing that the seat removal & paint job saved us money & time.

We appreciate your time & input.

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Old 11-27-2018, 11:21 AM   #2
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Howdy! Another thing of note is that mileage was not listed. Also, how big is that bus? However, even without that knowledge, I think that is way to steep for that year and drivetrain. My bus was $4,500 and I bought it at a dealer. '98 Carpenter 9-window with a DT-466E and AT545 Transmission.

John
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Old 11-27-2018, 11:29 AM   #3
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Mileage is 213,013
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Old 11-27-2018, 12:01 PM   #4
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I would double check the engine is truly a Cummins 5.9L. Most of the Ford chassis of that vintage had the Brazilian Ford diesel engine in them.

With that kind of mileage on a bus of that vintage with that transmission with that brand of body that asking price is about 2x of what it is worth.

If the bus has Girling brakes and/or the Brazilian Ford diesel walk very quickly away from it but not before you get your deposit back.

Ford chassis were never very popular even when they were new. Parts were always a challenge. Since Ford sold the medium/heavy duty truck division to Freightliner parts are no longer available from Ford unless the same parts were used on a light duty truck. Freightliner supported the parts until the models were 10-years old. As a consequence any dealer only parts have now become hard to find and are now made of unobtainium.

I know some of my prejudice against Ford is a Ford vs. Chevy vs. Dodge sort of dislike. But every Ford chassis bus I have ever driven was pokey on power, the ride was clunky, the steering did not cut corners as sharp, the dash layout was hard to read, and I really disliked the driver's position.
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Old 11-27-2018, 12:12 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by cowlitzcoach View Post
I would double check the engine is truly a Cummins 5.9L. Most of the Ford chassis of that vintage had the Brazilian Ford diesel engine in them.

With that kind of mileage on a bus of that vintage with that transmission with that brand of body that asking price is about 2x of what it is worth.

If the bus has Girling brakes and/or the Brazilian Ford diesel walk very quickly away from it but not before you get your deposit back.

Ford chassis were never very popular even when they were new. Parts were always a challenge. Since Ford sold the medium/heavy duty truck division to Freightliner parts are no longer available from Ford unless the same parts were used on a light duty truck. Freightliner supported the parts until the models were 10-years old. As a consequence any dealer only parts have now become hard to find and are now made of unobtainium.

I know some of my prejudice against Ford is a Ford vs. Chevy vs. Dodge sort of dislike. But every Ford chassis bus I have ever driven was pokey on power, the ride was clunky, the steering did not cut corners as sharp, the dash layout was hard to read, and I really disliked the driver's position.
I owned an 80's Thomas on a Ford chassis. Was just as you describe.
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Old 11-28-2018, 10:26 AM   #6
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Inspection Results On A '93 Carpenter B700

Thank you everyone for your input! We really appreciate it! We were able to reduce the price quite a bit & found a local & reputable bus mechanic that has comforted us with his knowledge too. Since our bus will only travel twice until it reaches its permanent home as a tiny house, we think all will go well.

Best to all of you!
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Old 11-28-2018, 07:22 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cowlitzcoach View Post
1 I would double check the engine is truly a Cummins 5.9L. Most of the Ford chassis of that vintage had the Brazilian Ford diesel engine in them.

With that kind of mileage on a bus of that vintage with that transmission with that brand of body that asking price is about 2x of what it is worth.

2 If the bus has Girling brakes and/or the Brazilian Ford diesel walk very quickly away from it but not before you get your deposit back.

Ford chassis were never very popular even when they were new. Parts were always a challenge. Since Ford sold the medium/heavy duty truck division to Freightliner parts are no longer available from Ford unless the same parts were used on a light duty truck. Freightliner supported the parts until the models were 10-years old. As a consequence any dealer only parts have now become hard to find and are now made of unobtainium.

..... 3 and I really disliked the driver's position.
(1) 1993 Ford switched away from their own 6.6L and 7.8L engines to the 5.9 & 8.3 cummins engines.
Those older engine were decent but not as clean on emission as the newer designed Cummins engine were. What Really made them different was the turbos on the driver side.

(2) I am a Ford Fan, But Not of those Girling brakes. They worked great, But WAAAY too pricey to fix.

(3) We had one of those buses here the brake pedal angle was different but it wasn't so bad you couldn't get used to it.
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Old 11-28-2018, 07:45 PM   #8
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Old 11-28-2018, 09:42 PM   #9
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so i have to ask? why a bus if you are just going to park it and never drive it again? I would be looking at rail containers or other mediums to build a tiny house vs a bus unless i wanted a travelling machine... if you park it for 10 years and finally decide you want to move.. you will likely have already ruined the drivetrain from sitting.. so the flexibility of moving is really gone.. and you have the wasted space of drivers area, suspension etc that a bus has you wouldnt need..
-Christopher
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Old 12-05-2018, 04:10 PM   #10
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Carpenter bus

Carpenter got a bad reputation as the top would collapse if they rolled. If you look, you will see that Carpenters have half the body rivets of other busses. Google Carpenter bus. You can find a wiki on them. I still see parts listed for carpenter.

I was told to stay away from them by more than one person when I used to go to the bus auctions.

Google how to read date codes on tires. This will tell you if you need to replace tires soon.
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Old 12-05-2018, 04:18 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by Lkn4it View Post
Carpenter got a bad reputation as the top would collapse if they rolled. If you look, you will see that Carpenters have half the body rivets of other busses. Google Carpenter bus. You can find a wiki on them. I still see parts listed for carpenter.

I was told to stay away from them by more than one person when I used to go to the bus auctions.

Google how to read date codes on tires. This will tell you if you need to replace tires soon.
here's all the info-
Quote:
All Carpenter school buses built in Mitchell, Indiana, no matter what the body number, should be inspected for cracked or broken welds in the roof structure.
Quote:
The buses in question are Carpenter Type “A” “B” “C” and “D” school buses built in Mitchell, Indiana, prior to the plant closing in late 1995. It appears that the buses built at Carpenter's Richmond, Indiana plant do not have similar problems.
https://icsw.nhtsa.gov/people/injury.../carpenterbus/
Quote:
NHTSA recommends that the following actions be taken with respect to any Carpenter school bus built in the Mitchell plant that has been found to have cracked or broken welds in the roof structure:

The bus should be taken out of service and replaced as soon as practicable.

If the bus must continue in use, the cracked or broken welds should be repaired as soon as possible by qualified service personnel.

In order to minimize the risk of a rollover, the bus should be used on routes that operate in low speed environments.
It has nothing to do with rivets or the amount of them. Newer buses have a lot less rivets than older ones regardless of maker.
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Old 12-05-2018, 06:47 PM   #12
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mamny carpenters have been repaired... mine was.. there were issues.. i wouldnt let it stop someone from building a skoolie out of one,,



-Christopher
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