NO CRANK - 1999 International Amtran RE - DT466E Allison MD3060
Hello all. I am having issues with my 1999 International Amtran RE Bus - DT466E engine with Allison MD3060 transmission. I had been working on the bus for several months over the winter and I recently tried to start the bus and it won’t crank. Before this issue, the bus started great and ran without issues.
When I turn the key to start the bus, the dash comes alive and the gauges sweep, however, the push button shift selector does not light up. There is also a fuse that keeps blowing every time I turn the key to run – fuse location F34 (below the driver side window in the fuse box) and it is a 30 amp with the description of “BAT FEED | AIR ABS.”
Both batteries have been charged and all the connections on them have been cleaned. I did remove several emergency exit windows and both roof emergency exits along with all the wiring for them. I understand that some of the problem might be due to the interlock caused by the open circuit of those wires being removed, but I don’t believe that would be causing the shifter panel to not activate and the continual blowing of that fuse. I’m stumped at this point, and due to the pandemic, I have to wait for my local truck mechanic (Associate International Dealer and Allison Transmission shop) to come out and take a look at it.
I would like to try things myself as I am trying to get the bus moved to continue working on projects. I have most all of the electrical diagrams for the bus, chassis, and transmission - so I am able to reference all of that.
If anyone has any idea as to what I can try, I would appreciate any help. If you need more info or pictures, just let me know.
Both batteries have been charged and all the connections on them have been cleaned. I did remove several emergency exit windows and both roof emergency exits along with all the wiring for them. I understand that some of the problem might be due to the interlock caused by the open circuit of those wires being removed, but I don’t believe that would be causing the shifter panel to not activate and the continual blowing of that fuse. I’m stumped at this point, and due to the pandemic, I have to wait for my local truck mechanic (Associate International Dealer and Allison Transmission shop) to come out and take a look at it.
If anyone has any idea as to what I can try, I would appreciate any help. If you need more info or pictures, just let me know.
The F34 being BAT FEED suggests this is a major main power feed for the whole bus from the battery bank. A short in such a circuit would take the whole bus down, no question about it.
You neglect to mention HOW you dealt with the wiring for the various interlock switches and such. What would have been best was to research the operation of the switch involved, whether it was a normally-open or normally-closed contact type. Also to identify whether these wires carried a ground or 12V. Then, either complete or interrupt the circuit as needed, and seal the connections with heat-shrink or something of the sort to keep the circuit from shorting out or getting wet.
I suspect you not only have one of these locking out the starter, but there is also likely a bare 12V wire (probably the same wire) shorting to chassis ground on the body, or a ground wire touching a 12V. That's the only reason a fuse would blow.
Could be something as simple as a wire being pinched or penetrated by a screw or nail, which could happen to anyone, but it's something to be mindful of in the conversion process. Also possible if the wires were tucked away into the wall and they were carrying 12V, could have wedged on a screw or rivet, etc. and creating a perpetual short.
If F34 is indeed a main battery feed for the entire bus' electrical system, this is also likely the reason your transmission control console isn't working. Hopefully it hasn't fried the electronics. Just my $0.02.
Hello all. I am having issues with my 1999 International Amtran RE Bus - DT466E engine with Allison MD3060 transmission. .....
When I turn the key to start the bus, the dash comes alive and the gauges sweep, however, the push button shift selector does not light up. There is also a fuse that keeps blowing every time I turn the key to run – fuse location F34 (below the driver side window in the fuse box) and it is a 30 amp with the description of “BAT FEED | AIR ABS.”
..... I understand that some of the problem might be due to the interlock caused by the open circuit of those wires being removed, but I don’t believe that would be causing the shifter panel to not activate and the continual blowing of that fuse. I’m stumped at this point, and due to the pandemic, I have to wait for my local truck mechanic (Associate International Dealer and Allison Transmission shop) to come out and take a look at it.
.....
If anyone has any idea as to what I can try, I would appreciate any help. If you need more info or pictures, just let me know.
Did you check the fuse for the TCU which should be located right at the battery, positive cable.
Also check the white wire too (negative batt cable)
Take an ohmmeter, preferably an old analog one if you have one, and test that white wire for good continuity to ground.
The fuse on the postive battery wire is what should feed power to the tranny TCU.
If you have issue with fuses blowing could be it took that fuse out of service too. If this fuse is blown, the tranny dash pad will not light up and bus will not start. I would pull the f34 fuse out, check the TCU fuse and just turn the key, without cranking, to see if the Tranny dash pad light does come on or not.
I uploaded for you the master wire list for your bus, which is the same as mine. all the wires in the bus should have numbers on them. If you cut, removed or re-spliced any wires, take a look at the number on the wire and check the master list to see what it is the you worked on. That might help you with the troubleshooting process.
I just uploaded for you the circuit diagram for the f34 fuse.
From what I can gather, it is the fuse for the abs system. Just pull the fuse for now and that should not affect or prevent the bus from starting, unless there are other issues too.
You will notice, on the circuit diagram, the ECM/TCU fuse is connected thru the "B" terminal of the starter solenoid. My backyard mechanical guess would be that maybe when the f34 fuse blows it is also taking out the ecm/tcu fuse with it ???
Just a wild guess on my part..
That fuse, F34, basically feeds the abs circuit.
Also, forgot to mention, make sure the rear start switch in the engine compartment is set properly for a front start.
Thank you for the reply. Sorry for the long time to reply - work in the healthcare field and its been really busy due to the pandemic.
Chris
Hi Chris, I got your PM... I pray for your safety dude.... Doing what you do for a living, especially today with this pandemic, I salute you !!!
Now for the bus,
Pull the f34 fuse and check the ECU fuse that is located by the battery.
Make sure that fuse is good.
Keeping the F34 fuse OUT. Make sure the start switch in the engine compartment is on the right setting. If it is set to rear start, the bus will never start when you turn the key up in the dash.
Turn the key to the "On" position and verify if the dash pad lights up or not.
If it does not light up then yes there might be a broken wire to the push pad which is a common occurrence.
This happened to me and I found a loose/broken wire at the actual connector next to the tranny.
If the ECU fuse is good and assuming you did not fry the TCU, next step is checking for 12 volts at the dash pad itself. Not hard to do just a bit time consuming.
Try the simple things first to see if that works or not, fuse, rear start switch...etc...
Hey everyone, sorry for delayed update. I FINALLY got the bus back from my Local international dealer. It’s been there since mid January and due to COVID, they have been behind. They also said that it was a pain in the ass to figure out the issue so they would work little by little h til they got frustrated and left it. While I get it, that’s kind of BS as I’m a paying customer and the fact that they just kept putting isn’t ok.
Either way, it’s done. There were several wires in the wiring harness that were corroded that they had to replace. Also, the ABS control module that is blowing the ABS fuse is bad (full of corrosion) but not effecting drivability yet. That part alone is $2000 new so I’m going to find a used one and see if I can install it myself or bring it to another Truck repair place.
For all of the wiring, replacing fuel pump primer, fuel filters, installing new batteries I provided, and a few other things, the total was $1750. Most of that is labor and diagnostics. All in all, I’m sure it could have been done cheaper at a non international dealer.
corroding wires is a common theme on IH it seems.. from what ive seen on my own IH's is that the rubber they used for grommets going through metal holes was less than stellar so it of course leads to chaffing.. the other thing ive found is that not all the connectors are water proof or water reisstant.. I think some of it is water getting where its never designed to get.. (like inside the switch panel)..
in school bus builder's non-infinite wisdom somehow switch panels have ended up right under the driver window.. and its been that way for decades.. bus drivers often drive with the window open in the rain.. as well as notoriously leave the driver window open overnight and it might rain / snow.. over time this results in electrical gremlins..
I think it esp occurs as wiring that hasne been disturbed in many years becomes touched when a bus becomes a skoolie.. things are opened up and wiring is shifted around.. even if items arent removed, if you move around corroded connectors connections get wonky and die..
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