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Old 10-24-2023, 04:08 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
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T444E Fuel lift pump failure?

New member here, I have a 95 International 4700 T444E I was hoping someone here will have some knowledge of this engine. Started it up today, let it idle to warm up, started knocking more than usual. Not rod knock but ignition knock. Had no throttle response then died. I removed a plug on the fuel pressure regulator on the fuel bowl and some air escaped, I cranked the engine over and nothing came out. Would it be safe to assume my lift pump has failed? Thanks

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Old 10-24-2023, 11:37 PM   #2
Mini-Skoolie
 
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Update, after I posted the first thread I went out and after cranking on it for about 25 seconds the truck started and ran normal. After about 3 minuets it started getting choppy again, but would still respond to throttle. Then smoothed out again. I did notice my volt gauge was showing 12volts when running. Put my multi meter on the alternator and verified it's not charging. Possible low voltage issue? Going to pull the alternator and have it tested.
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Old 10-25-2023, 07:56 AM   #3
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Year: 1991
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low voltage will cause issue, the lift pump is mechanical on the T444E, its in the valley.. the fuel bowl is on the positive side of the lift pump, however ive seen the lines from the tank crank that lead up to the lift pump which can cause it to suck air.. and you typically wont see visible leaks as its on the negative side..
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Old 10-25-2023, 05:13 PM   #4
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New Alternator is on order, also got a new ICP. The old one appeared to be working, I could hear the engine slightly change tune when I unplugged it. But there was fuel in the connector.
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Old 10-25-2023, 07:58 PM   #5
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shpuldnt be fuel in the connector.. should be engine oil if it leaks
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Old 10-25-2023, 08:36 PM   #6
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Year: 1995
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https://www.dieselhub.com/maintenanc...placement.html


Is this the fuel pump that is used on the T444E?
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Old 10-25-2023, 09:13 PM   #7
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thios show as IDI.. our T444E is not a 7.3 IDI, its closer to the 94-96 ford 7.3 powerstroke when it comes to lift pump..


https://swagperformanceparts.com/199...transfer-pump/
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Old 10-26-2023, 01:58 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
shpuldnt be fuel in the connector.. should be engine oil if it leaks
Correct, obviously I wasn't thinking when I wrote that.
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Old 10-26-2023, 02:00 AM   #9
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The swag performance pump looks like what I have, and the listing says it fits 7.3L powerstroke and T444E. Does anyone know if that's true?
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Old 10-26-2023, 07:38 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aawil View Post
The swag performance pump looks like what I have, and the listing says it fits 7.3L powerstroke and T444E. Does anyone know if that's true?

the ford version of the T444E (powersdtroke 7.3) used the same fuel pump from 94-97 (known as OBS trucks).. there was no 1998 ford F250/F350. in 99 the Ford version of the 7.3 went to an electric fuel pump setup for the lift pump and the valley in the engine got a block-off plate...


International continued to use the mechanical fuel pump all the way through till the end of the 7.3 production (USA) in 2004.. the 7.3 lived another year or 2 in non US markets.. no idea what they had for fuel pumps..



as far as I know the international version used the same pump for all of its years..


for reference.. International Built and sold the T444E to Ford for their trucks.. ford named it the Powerstroke 7.3, many of the parts are the same but not all.. as ford had to make changes so it would fit into a pickup truck body.. so things like the accessory pulleys,brackets, fan, coolant lines, alernators, Turbo Chargers, ECM, and the like are different as ford used their own parts..



in general ford took the IH version of the engine, maxxed out its Horsepower, ran the revs higher, installed their own components so it could compete in the consumer truck world.. IH built them to not particularly be powerful but to last forever...



when you go looking for parts you have to be mindful of what you are looking for... core operational parts are much the same so you can shop for powerstroke parts.. in fact when changing the glowplugs the only ones you buy are the ones from ford as others were known to fail and cause havok.. I have ford glowplugs and alliant performance injectors (sold for ford 7.3)in my T444E.. my upgraded HPOP and HPOP lines were sold for ford...
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Old 10-26-2023, 09:38 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
thios show as IDI.. our T444E is not a 7.3 IDI, its closer to the 94-96 ford 7.3 powerstroke when it comes to lift pump..


https://swagperformanceparts.com/199...transfer-pump/

Thanks for this, saved to my part number list for when I eventually may need one!
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Old 10-26-2023, 01:44 PM   #12
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Thanks for the clarification
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Old 10-26-2023, 10:40 PM   #13
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This turned into quite a fiasco, alternator came in today. It looked exactly like the old one and is supposed to be a Delco CS-130. But the front of the alternator was different, used different mounting locations and a smaller pulley. The owner of the parts store thought he would save me some time and swapped the front covers of the alternators and pulleys. Got home with it and installed it, fired the truck up and it went to 13 revved the engine showed 14 volts then back to 12. Can't get it to charge now. They have since found the part number to the alternator I need and are going to warranty this one out and get the correct one. Anyway, this is a Delco CS-130 alternator and uses a B+ connection and one wire in the 4 pin connector, based on a diagram I found it looks like it's the F wire. I haven't been able to find what function this F wire does. Does it supply an excite signal to the alternator to start charging? Truck seems to be running good now, hooked a fuel pressure gauge up and have 39psi at the regulator idling.
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Old 10-27-2023, 07:39 AM   #14
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interesting on it being a CS alternator.. I guess the truck versions are different than the busses.. my bus alternator defimnitely isnt a CS.. im using a CS on my Loadstar using an aftermarket harness that handles the terminals correctly.


if a CS is wired incorrectly the regulator will fry in a matter of minutes..could be the one you got was designed for a different pinout and thus the regulator died in it quickly.. most often what ive seen is they will simply push every bit they can till they dont.. im guessing this exceeds the rating on the diode bridge..
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Old 10-27-2023, 12:43 PM   #15
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I think they used a few different alternators on the trucks, possibly buses too. CS-130 is on the line setting ticket on the air filter cover. Shouldn't have been a pin arrangement issue. Both alternators connectors are labeled PLFS in the same order and only use the F wire. There's one wire that is connected to a square pin adapter to connect to the alternator. There is another square connector with a metripack cap at the rear of the alternator labeled ABC, that's unused and another single black wire, also unused. I am getting battery voltage with key on to the F terminal.
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Old 10-27-2023, 02:31 PM   #16
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Started it up this morning, was charging at 14v. Voltage then came down to 13-13.5. Then down to 12.5 at the alternator bat+ wire and the F wire. Then went back to charging at 14.5. Truck ran maybe 10 minuets then got choppy again and died. Cranked maybe 10 seconds ran rough then cleared up and ran another maybe 10 minuets hooked my fuel pressure gauge up after restarting it. Had 38 psi for a couple minuets, watched it drop to 20 ran for probably 8 minuets remaining at 20psi before getting choppy and stalling again. Any ideas? Tech manual says fuel psi is 20 minimum and if i remember correctly can range to 70. Probably need to get a scan tool on it to figure out what's actually going on. Any recommendations on a good one?
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Old 10-28-2023, 03:15 AM   #17
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Spent some time going over the fuel supply system. I blew air through both lines to the tank, seem clear. Put my gauge after the lift side of the fuel pump, had 10 psi and the pump was filling the fuel bowl. Took both return lines off the heads, they were open. Took the fuel pressure regulator apart and blew it out with QD electronic cleaner. I compared the spring to one in another regulator I had and it was slightly shorter than the spare. So I installed the spare spring refilled the fuel bowl and started the truck. Had 38-40 psi fuel pressure and it idled for 20-30 minuets and didn't miss a lick. Fuel pressure stayed the same at any RPM. The Diagnostic manual states fuel pressure should be 30-65 psi at high idle. I have read some other threads where people have stretched this spring to increase the fuel pressure. Thinking I should do that as I am on the lower side of the range.
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Old 10-28-2023, 07:50 AM   #18
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Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
there were 2 springs sold.. the original up through 99 was a 45 PSI spring.. then a kit was released with a 65 PSI spring.. the idea was to combat "injector knock" .. at low idle and hot many 444E's sounded like they had an intermittent rod knock which was actualy an injector plunger bottoming out on the #8 cylinder.. IH felt higher rail pressure would help to combat this. and it did on mine.. so your fuel pump should suffer no ill effects running up at 65-70..



did I notice any power difference? maybe psychologically but never measured any real difference.. what really woke it up is the beefed injectors, the adrenaline HPOP.. and the Orion Tuner..
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Old 10-28-2023, 10:11 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
there were 2 springs sold.. the original up through 99 was a 45 PSI spring.. then a kit was released with a 65 PSI spring.. the idea was to combat "injector knock" .. at low idle and hot many 444E's sounded like they had an intermittent rod knock which was actualy an injector plunger bottoming out on the #8 cylinder.. IH felt higher rail pressure would help to combat this. and it did on mine.. so your fuel pump should suffer no ill effects running up at 65-70..



did I notice any power difference? maybe psychologically but never measured any real difference.. what really woke it up is the beefed injectors, the adrenaline HPOP.. and the Orion Tuner..
Last week or so I was looking at injectors for an 03 bus with the T444e that I need to pick up in GA which has low miles on a Reviva engine. The kits had AD injectors for #'s 1-7 and AE injector for the #8 based on a bulletin to help eliminate knock.

CK,Which injectors did you use?
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Old 10-28-2023, 10:52 AM   #20
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Year: 1991
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Chassis: International 3800
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Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
yeah that AE was another thing they came out with for all 99.5+ (theres an engine serial number cutoff when they added the AE).. AD injecotrs were standard in 99.5+.


I used Dynomite Diesel stage 1 (15% nozzle) Split shot AD with the #8 AE.. im running them with an Adrenaline HPOP and the HPOP line upgrade as I had an HPOP line starting to leak.. my old HPOP was starting to get weak..



some people like single shot injectors better for higher performance, you need an ECM tune for them like an Orion .. split shot injectors tend to take a little beefier HPOP to not set 333 codes during extended heavy loading.. single shots are noisier apparently.. (AC code injectors).. im lucky my engine is one that still has forged rods.. although plenty of people running hopped up later model engines with PMR rods..



my big hinderance now is my gears.. im way too tall in the rear.. the bus was close to a 70 MPH bus when it still had the AT545 so with my 6 speed allison its easy to lug.. since my turbo is the stock non waste-gated 1.0 / 1.0 AR theres not a lot of spooling at lower RPM.. sure I can build 32 PSI of boost but fro mwhat I understand that turbo is pretty upside down at that point.. so want to go with something like a KC300 .84 AR with a wicked-wheel in it and a wastegate..
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