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Old 03-29-2023, 08:12 PM   #1
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: East TN
Posts: 191
Year: 1999
Chassis: International
Engine: T444E
1999 International Thomas Not Turning Over

Hi,

I bought my second bus, a 1999 International Thomas with the T444E, with a reman engine from Reviva with 30k miles if the odometer was changed out when they put the engine in.

It started out as a school bus, then was used by the sheriffís department for a few years. I assume the necessary safety interlocks were long since disabled. Maybe not.

It runs great but currently wonít start. I hear a click to the left of the drivers seat and the starter doesnít do anything. For the last few months she has started perfectly. The wait to start light comes on. She does not crank.

I tried to bypass all of it with a hot directly to the starter. The starter then turns but isnít engaging the flywheel. Weird. Something in that system must not get power when I bypass the ignition (with key on).

The roof openings have wires that were cut before I bought it and it was starting. All but one of the emergency windows still buzz if I unlatch them. The rear door opened or latched closed doesnít change anything.

The thing that I hear click is yellow and rectangular. Iíll see if I can post a pic.

Iím running out of easy ideas I know to try.

Any suggestions?
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Old 03-29-2023, 09:20 PM   #2
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Join Date: Mar 2017
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running a hot cable to starter will not engage the soloinoid that engages the drive gear to the flywheel so what it did is normal.. if you jump he soloinoid from the battery connection to the positive signal connection (one of the 2 small ones but not the one that grounds it) that should start it. i would look for a bad relay
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Old 03-30-2023, 06:06 AM   #3
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: East TN
Posts: 191
Year: 1999
Chassis: International
Engine: T444E
Thanks mmoore. I think I was jumping to the small hot. The other small is verified to go to ground. The starter spun but didn’t engage. Of course the small hot gets buried in the harness so backtracking is difficult. That would be the only signal the starter gets to both spin and engage correct? Maybe I misunderstood your post. What is that big yellow rectangular thing I posted a pic of?

I will check the relays as well, that’s seems easy enough. Hopefully they’re labeled…
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Old 03-30-2023, 07:28 AM   #4
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Engine: DTA360 / MT643
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if that bus is an automatic make sure your shifter is clearly in 'N'. the navistar computer disables the starter if the neutral safety switch goes open.. sometimes its easy to bump the sifter or if the cable is slightly misadjusted it will break the circuit.. so its worth mving the sifter up and back a couple clicks anbd back ti 'N' and try again.. if its a stick.. pump the clutch a few times to the floor and back to exercise the clutch switch..
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Old 03-30-2023, 09:34 AM   #5
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Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Iowa City, IA
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Year: 2006
Chassis: IC CE300 (PB105)
Engine: DT466e @245hp | Allison 3000PTS
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This video I did a while back covers the DT466e, but a lot of the principals behind a no-start condition apply to the T444e also. Maybe something in there will help.

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Old 03-30-2023, 11:03 AM   #6
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
Location: East TN
Posts: 191
Year: 1999
Chassis: International
Engine: T444E
O.M.G. She was in drive. Put it in N and she fired right up!!! This thing has been sitting for weeks due to not starting!! Hahaha �� Thank you Chris and everyone! -Dbacks, I’m still gonna watch your video. Always wanting to learn more.

-Chris, if you’re ever passing through East TN I owe you a beer and/or dinner! You could come stay at my wife’s and mine place. Plenty of room for a bus and I even have septic and generator.
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Old 03-30-2023, 12:24 PM   #7
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First thing that should have been discussed was battery voltage.
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Old 03-30-2023, 01:04 PM   #8
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2020
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Posts: 191
Year: 1999
Chassis: International
Engine: T444E
Charged Batteries

Good Point Sporty, I forgot to mention that was the first thing I did was to ensure a proper charge and checked with a voltmeter.

I left it in drive forgetting of course that it has to be in Neutral to start. She started up in one milisecond once I put the transmission in the proper gear!
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Old 03-30-2023, 02:50 PM   #9
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sometimes i have to wiggle my shifter in neutral a little bit while trying to start.
after setting for awhile its a definite must but after doing it once or twice it goes away while i am using the bus but after it sets for a couple of months it shows up.
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Old 04-03-2023, 11:06 PM   #10
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Year: 2006
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Chassis: CE200
Engine: International VT365
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diverdude0075 View Post
Good Point Sporty, I forgot to mention that was the first thing I did was to ensure a proper charge and checked with a voltmeter.

I left it in drive forgetting of course that it has to be in Neutral to start. She started up in one milisecond once I put the transmission in the proper gear!
Yeah, the neutral safety interlock is a very easy thing to overlook if the bus isn’t starting (before delving into mechanical diagnosis). It’s gotten me a few times, both on the buses I’ve used at work, and aboard Sabrina as well. Even regular cars and trucks (with automatics) have the same thing. Rule of thumb that I was told was that if the engine started in any gear other than park or neutral, that hinted at a serious problem.

I am not sure if manuals have something similar equipped. Perhaps they do but I’m not sure at all.
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