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Old 10-14-2020, 08:32 PM   #21
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Join Date: Jul 2015
Location: Montana/Texas
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Year: 1998
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Chassis: International 3800
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Ok, so the shutters were set to open at 204(!) and close at 175... interesting.

I've changed it to open at 175 and close at 150. We'll see how that does when I travel again on Friday. Interested to see how the fan reacts...

What yall think?

John

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Old 10-14-2020, 08:38 PM   #22
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Join Date: May 2009
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actually the 204 / 175 makes sense.. they give you a fully solid warm up with reserve for the heaters and then should only close up on cool days or if you are on a mild day and traverse a long hill descent where you are generating no heat.. otherwise they would cycle once on first statrup and then never cycle again. . if your fan is set too cold then the fan can run and cause the shutters to close.. the factory fan clutch setting is high.. much higher than I ever like to see one.. your shutter temperature now in my opinion is too cold.. they will cycle once and then never again. which is fine, if you have enough cabin heat then you leave it there.. and the fan most surely should turn off.. if it doesnt then the clutch is stuck..
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Old 10-14-2020, 09:07 PM   #23
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I guess what I also need to figure out is the fan setting...
How could I do that without removing the clutch? I replaced the fan clutch about 3 years ago, and I don't have the documentation and sure don't remember what the setting was. I do remember that I didn't mess with it though...

John
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Old 10-16-2020, 10:23 PM   #24
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Ok, well driving all day with the new shutter adjustment wasn't bad....

There must be an issue with my fan clutch or it is set wrong? It definitely seems to run more than it needs to. No matter what the temp, whenever I get to high RPMs, that thing screams!!!
The coolant Temps definitely run on the colder side. Normal driving at regular grades, the temp was around 175 - 179...
Up a prolonged grade, the warmest I saw was 186...
The fan is definitely not locked up, though as I can spint it by hand. The only thing I can think of is that I bought the wrong one back in 2017. I Actually found the emIl confirmation, but can find any good specs on it as far as set temp...

I have attached a picture of the email with the part number if anyone else's Google-fu turns up more than I could...

So it sounds like I may need to get another clutch that is set up correctly?

Would love some feedback!!

Thanks!

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Old 10-17-2020, 05:03 AM   #25
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There’s lots of clutches. I’m running kit-masters clutches on on my busses.. well red one now is Norton but was KM.
You can also call na Ishtar with your VIN get the factory clutch part number ( and crazy price). But then it can be crossed to an aftermarket unit. Kit masters , borg Warner. Or such .

The factory setting will likely be a bit high.. navistar likes to run these engines hot. The factory Horton turn on speed was like 212.

I turned on my shutters Friday since it was cool out. They open just before my temp gauge reached the center and they close as the needle just about hits 180z I think we both have the 230 top temp gauge? If I remember right that was 195 or so for the open. My fan only ran when I first started the bus then shut off after a couple minutes.
You could pull the clutch and see if the spring broke or something. There are many different spin on models.. I know if the clutch spins backwards it definitely will stay on all the time but they aren’t suppose to thread onto a water pump which isn’t designed for proper rotation..

If that clutch is kit masters then I’d call them with the part number and verify what it’s parameters are.

Even if it’s adjusted too cool the range of adjustment should have it shutting off when your engine is cold.. it’s harder to hear behind the shutters.
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Old 10-17-2020, 09:50 AM   #26
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Couldn't tell you if it's correct or not. Like chris said, you'll have to contact navistar for a part number and then see if it crosses to what you have. The number on your invoice did come up on a kitmasters interchange, so you should be able to find it.

If it never disengages, I'd say it's failed engaged and not an adjustment issue. Although it's rare, I have seen those thermal springs break and that will leave the clutch stuck in whatever state it is currently at. Hard to believe it would happen with it being that new, but something isn't right.

Sounds like an inspection with a mirror or borescope is in order.

You're shutter adjustment is where I would have it at. You can run the open temp a little warmer, just make sure the thermostat isn't fully open when you do have the shutters finally open. That wild swinging of coolant temps isn't good, and in frigid conditions, I was told that swing can cause cracking of blocks/liners.
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Old 10-17-2020, 12:55 PM   #27
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Thanks, guys - Appreciate the info!
I'll let you know how it goes...

John
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Old 10-17-2020, 03:31 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Booyah45828 View Post
Couldn't tell you if it's correct or not. Like chris said, you'll have to contact navistar for a part number and then see if it crosses to what you have. The number on your invoice did come up on a kitmasters interchange, so you should be able to find it.

If it never disengages, I'd say it's failed engaged and not an adjustment issue. Although it's rare, I have seen those thermal springs break and that will leave the clutch stuck in whatever state it is currently at. Hard to believe it would happen with it being that new, but something isn't right.

Sounds like an inspection with a mirror or borescope is in order.

You're shutter adjustment is where I would have it at. You can run the open temp a little warmer, just make sure the thermostat isn't fully open when you do have the shutters finally open. That wild swinging of coolant temps isn't good, and in frigid conditions, I was told that swing can cause cracking of blocks/liners.

that temperature swing didnt excite me much either.. its what prompted me to install the disable switch.. driving around in town on a cold day its a good bet that as much as i turn on the heat (lets just say aint no freezin goin on inside my bus). that the shutters stay closed up.. but once i hit the highway even in real cold weather I always experienced that up down up down swing.. so i can turn the shutters off and my temp gauge stays pretty consistent just below or at the 180 mark.. so i know my tstat is good but I dont get those swings every couple minutes.. the thernostat for mine is non adjustable since its on a mechanical engine.. its just a switch. and theres no adjusting it.. I could install a digital control on them but never have.
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:24 AM   #29
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Location: Wake Forest NC
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I have the T444E and the split rad in our Vista

like most I removed the rear heater, but i still have the lines going all the way back to the stern and I just looped them there


I was thinking to install a 2nd radiator there and an Aux fan somewhere under the bus for additional cooling


still in the idea phase.. but those are pretty thick lines, might be worth doing...

we only creep up in temp climbing hard, and we also have an Allison 2000
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:38 AM   #30
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Yeah, I may wait until I get my transmission switched out and see how she does. I drove pretty hard when I picked it up but once I backed off she was fine. I’m thinking if I want extra cooling that the radiator (rear heater) could work. I would just use it’s fans and mount the whole thing with the protective housing underneath. It would be pretty easy. For now though I’m in demo phase. I hope to pick the transmission up in about a month. It’s gonna get stored at a family members house close to the seller until I can get it. My only other consideration for the heater is how to isolate the drivers area heat while the rear one is on. I may go split unit for the bus and then could completely bypass drivers heat. Lots to ponder... ��
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Old 10-20-2020, 11:43 AM   #31
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the only issue with using heater lines for aux radiator is it means you have the heat on up front to be able to cool your system.. the only time youd be usiong it is in summer when you want A/C not heat..



you can Y in ahead of your heater valves. but would want to be able to valve off that rad for winter so it doesnt hurt your ability to heat..



I had thought about doing it on mine but seems my issue doesnt exist. the 24" plastic fan alone is a help..



235 is when navistar sets off the alarm bells. so from what everyone tells me if you are staying under 220-225 no need to worry.. im an old school diesel guy who likes em below 205. but apparently its not necessary.. nevertheless who knows what i'll find when I have my engine cranked up pushing 300HP.. I may be making that full rad swap or an aux unit of some sort..
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