96 t444e no start - Page 2

Bungeekord · 10-09-2017, 09:13 PM

Various Tests at harness to Idm show power and no short. Going to get a new one tomorrow from a place that allows returns to rule it out.

cadillackid · 10-09-2017, 09:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bungeekord

Various Tests at harness to Idm show power and no short. Going to get a new one tomorrow from a place that allows returns to rule it out.

one advantage to your 3 box system is the separate IDM!.. on mine its all baked into the much higher priced ECM..

sounds like you got a good handle on this!

-Christopher

Tango · 10-09-2017, 09:33 PM

I think I know the problem. It's that "E".

Bungeekord · 10-09-2017, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tango

I think I know the problem. It's that "E".

Damn right, wishing i went with an older style engine, all mechanical... oh well...

Bungeekord · 10-10-2017, 01:24 PM

Ok, replaced IDM with another known to work and its still not starting and throwing same codes...
Could it b the wireharness below the valve cover going to injectors? Im running out of ideas with this thing...

Rusty · 10-10-2017, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bungeekord

Ok, replaced IDM with another known to work and its still not starting and throwing same codes...
Could it b the wireharness below the valve cover going to injectors? Im running out of ideas with this thing...

Wish I could help. There are a few new guys on the board with experience with that motor who I would reach-out to.

golfersmurf57

and

Johnny Mullet

Good luck !! You got this !!!

Bungeekord · 10-10-2017, 11:08 PM

We are frantically looking for someone with a diagnostic computer to help us further trouble shoot this thing. Have a few leads, hoping they pan out.

Turns out the IDM we got this am was used and may or may not work, and its off an 88 7.3 ford van, so who knows how compatible it is.

The local international dealer wanted $1,100.00 for an IDM and they needed 2 weeks to send it off to get programmed. So that's out of the question... considering this: 1995-1999 Navistar T444E Injector Driver Modules (IDM) but want to be sure the IDM is at fault before throwing more money at this stubborn POS...

Honestly though, after 10 years with not a single problem, I am still a fan of this engine, just not a fan of working on it ; )

Rusty · 10-10-2017, 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bungeekord

The local international dealer wanted $1,100.00 for an IDM and they needed 2 weeks to send it off to get programmed. So that's out of the question... considering this: 1995-1999 Navistar T444E Injector Driver Modules (IDM) but want to be sure the IDM is at fault before throwing more money at this stubborn POS...

$200 on ebay

Bungeekord · 10-11-2017, 01:02 AM

yeah, if they can verify that the idm is specifically applicable to this engine then id go for it.

Im interested in purchasing a diagnostic tool to keep this thing running for the long haul but Im confused about which one i need and how it interfaces with a labtop. My mechanic buddy says the knock offs are crap and you need specific programs for specific engines, and its all pricey.

Everything about these engines seems complicated and expensive by design.

Johnny Mullet · 10-11-2017, 06:25 AM

Sounds like an IDM issue or wiring harness issue to me. A real scanner will verify this if it is unable to perform a buzz test on the injectors. I would start by trying to get a wiring diagram and continuity testing the wires from the IDM to the valve cover harnesses and then remove the valve covers and test the other side of the circuit.

cadillackid · 10-11-2017, 08:05 AM

I would go back to making sure that the IDM has power.. the *MOST* common thing I see with a bad IDM is that it fails out one bank of injectors.. a comms issue Can be the ECM, but making sure the IDM is truly getting power and ground.. (measure your power and ground on the pins of the IDM harness connector.. dont use the frame for ground, use the connector pins.. just tp be sure.

in your service manual does it talk about doing the harness checks? I can look through mine again to see if there are any, but ultimately a single fault in the harness on power or ground or one of the comms lines will cause issues. also of course a blown fuse for the IDM or one of the 2 ECM fuses will cause a failure.

the diagnostic tool for that is most likely ServiceMaxx J1708 and its free from Navistar, the hardware interface is a Nexiq USBLINK-2 or one of the chinese knockoffs.. Servicemaxx requires an RP1210 compliant interface.

-Christopher

Bungeekord · 10-12-2017, 12:42 PM

Had a guy come this morning with a diagnostic computer, but it wouldn't stay connected long enough to do much. This coincides with the scan gauge not reading codes and acting a bit schizophrenic... WTF?!?!

On top of this, the starter has **** the bed from so much cranking so needs replacing. Any thoughts on gear reduction vs the regular 50 + lb starters?

This is becoming a hellish nightmare.

Bungeekord · 10-12-2017, 12:50 PM

also, how many volts should we be seeing at the injector harness? I know its much higher then 12, just unsure how much higher...

cadillackid · 10-12-2017, 12:56 PM

if the scan tool keeps disconnecting.. make sure you have good voltage at the ECM and not a partial open.. and that your batteries are FULLY charged... the 444E needs good voltage at the ECM.. you may want to re-seat the connectors on it too.. I would use the OEM starter.. I thought i read somewhere the 444E requires a certain RPM before it will attempt to start.. if one out of your 2 batteries are no good it can cause your ECM to do wacko things.... (and your starter too)..
-Christopher

Bungeekord · 10-12-2017, 03:56 PM

Both batteries and the starter tested out fine! Hahaha?!?!

Going to clean every ground, connection, etc i can find bt battery and starter

Rusty · 10-12-2017, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bungeekord

Both batteries and the starter tested out fine! Hahaha?!?!

Going to clean every ground, connection, etc i can find bt battery and starter

I think he (Christopher) wants you to check the computer's grounds, as well. If it turns over ok, then starter has ground. All the other weirdness can be attributed to low voltage at the brain unit.

Bungeekord · 10-19-2017, 01:32 PM

Bus started and ran on Saturday. Were not quite sure what the issue was. I had disconnected and reconnected a plug under the driver side motor mount, that might have been the culprit.
Also as we were diagnosing the idm it seemed the idm relay wasnt getting ground? Jumped a ground to it but it didnt seem to b clicking off. Then on a whim just tried to crank it over... it started right up!
So, not totally sure what the hell happened but were back on the road! Made it to Port Townsend, will be doing a much needed oil change here and look into why the trans is shifting strangley now (needs much higher rpm to shift into 4th gear then before...).
The turbo is making some noise also, worse at start up, quiets down after it runs a while but theres definitely some type of leak, weve been smelling exhaust in the cab on and off for a while now. Pulled the air intake and can see some play in the turbo.
Scan gauge is showing that past 2000 rpms it is building boost, but the bus is definitely driving differently, taking linger to build up speed, and shifting a bit differently. Could this all be related to a failing or leaking turbo?

Where should i look for a turbo? Are remans ok or stick to oem?

Constant work this thing, not to mention the $$$. But its soo good to be back on the road!

cadillackid · 10-19-2017, 02:25 PM

do you have an exhaust backpressure valve? those are active when the engine is cold and impedes exhaist flow / boost.. its deisgned to help the engine warm up in colder weather.. if that is either activating liek its supposed to due to colder weather or is malfunctioning it can cause some of the symptoms you describe..

bad grounds are a plague when it comes to engine electronics.. that why its always best to test for power / ground to each module first and at its own connectors if possible. anything under the hood is subject to weather / water infiltration...
-Christopher

Bungeekord · 10-19-2017, 03:43 PM

Yes have ebp sensor. Removed tube because it was clogged, it broke when i removed it. The leg from Spokane to Pt Townsend we just had a plug on the exhaust port, sensor was running open. Ordered new pipe, should be here tomorrow. Hopingvthat fixes the shifting issue...

cadillackid · 10-19-2017, 04:51 PM

does your allison 545 have an electronic modulator on it? when you are at a high engine load the solenoid should activate and make that modulator click. if the shift points are really low even under full throttle then that modulator is not activating..

if the shift points are always too high then that modulator may be sticking on..

when the AT545 failed in my redbyrd, the modulator had been bad for ??? it had never activated my downshifts when I stomped it.. and my valve body started having issues.. I didnt get my downshifts to first when I stopped at a light till sometimes 30 seconds or more sitting stopped.. I replaced the modulator and then had my kickdowns but the damage of constant low pressure was done.. if you arent getting slips in your shifts, you have a good chance of solving valve issues by flushing and changing internal and external filters..
-Christopher

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