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Old 01-01-2023, 02:03 PM   #41
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Thank you, not closing my account. Just dropping the subject on this forum until I have something to Show-N-Tell.....

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Old 01-01-2023, 08:04 PM   #42
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Originally Posted by John W. Miller View Post
Thank you, not closing my account. Just dropping the subject on this forum until I have something to Show-N-Tell.....
And please DO show and tell, because if you figure it out you'll become our resident tandem skoolie expert!

One final example, if you want to look for this online. For a period in the 70s and 80s Blue Bird made their Wanderlodge RVs which were basically their school buses turned into RVs from the manufacturer. Some of these I've seen were tandem axles but I'll admit I cannot be certain they were both drive axles. The third axle may have been an unpowered tag axle which isn't really what you're looking for I know. But for as many of these as were made and as close-knit as that online community is I've no doubt if you start asking the questions they'll have far more real-world knowledge than this community on that particular subject.
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Old 01-05-2023, 06:51 AM   #43
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Dual rear for additional load carrying sounds logical. Locking axle better for tough conditions like snow or sand. All wheel (add Front) wheels definitely better then driving second set of pushers. Semis are hopeless in snow because of free wheeling. Total weight might be a killer. Forget about safety inspection unless you’re a certified shop.

Fun project though, lots of cool setups online
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Old 01-05-2023, 09:39 PM   #44
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Most any truck with tandem axles can be transplanted. It's going to sit much higher, drop front axle down too. You want the ratio close or same as what you have now. Takes more power to run duels and mileage going to take a hit. Heavy unit,lot more gears to turn
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Old 01-06-2023, 05:28 AM   #45
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John, have you contemplated using a military fmtv as a base. Grafting a bus body on it might be fun.
I am doing something like that with a 404 unimog and a small bus
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Old 01-06-2023, 09:09 AM   #46
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Intriguing.
.
a)
I think a different engine would be my starting point.
Instead of the little 466 (220hp?), I would look at a Cummins ISM in the range of 450hp or so, with a commensurate increase in torque.
That would allow a higher top-speed, or a lower rpm at the regular cruise for a bus.
.
b)
About three decades ago, we converted a 1984 Peterbilt for full-time live-aboard.
Cummins 400 BC, 8LL, tandem with lockers and inter-lock.
Problem:
On the rough logger tracks to remote mountain lakes we prefer, those eight tires tended to float.
Instead of offering more traction than a single axle, they gave less traction.
Instead of digging in, they spun on top of the dirt... an on-n-off perpetual 'burn-out'.
Those repetitive jolts are hard on components such as suspension bushings and tires.
.
That trans had a rarely-used low first-gear -- we usually started with second-gear -- plus a granny low-low.
Paired with the axles ratio of 2.88, we crept along just fine, with the ability to cruise 65mph all day.
.
c)
Accessing remote areas requires a low low-gear.
Creeping at 1-5mph gives the crew time to respond to abrupt changes in the road surface, steer around pits and boulders, and is usually easier on the suspension.
.
A lower low-gear with a higher creeping rpm also allows faster circulation of trans fluid, potentially extending the life of the trans innerds.
.
d)
re -- weaving through bushes:
2003, after a long series of make-do camping in lesser rigs, we converted a short wheel-base commercial truck to our concept of an ExpeditionVehicle.
.
Single axle with factory air-locker.
Nearly two decades full-time live-aboard.
Summers up rough logger tracks to remote mountain lakes.
Winters on isolated Baja beaches.
.
We think 2x4 is adequate for our purposes.
Twenty-four months twenty-four thousand miles around South America, we saw dozens of converted 4x4 and 6x6 euro-mil, but they rarely go off-road.
If they stick the thing, they call the local military to drag them back to pavement.
.
e)
re -- ratio swap to increase top-speed
That would be the opposite of the creeping speed we prefer for the back-country.
Fact is, we are comfortable at 52mph in the slow-lane.
.
This morning, I eaves-dropped on a conversation about Interstate Five through California.
The crazed maniacs felt put-upon if their 85mph was interrupted by traffic and weather.
Eighty-five miles per hour.
Good grief.
Give me a Baja beach any day.
.
.
Our introduction with plenty of portraits, plus our reasons for our decisions:
https://vanlivingforum.com/threads/e...8/#post-576110
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Old 01-10-2023, 07:16 PM   #47
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Thank you for posting this question(s). I have a 2003 Bluebird (12 window) on a International 3800 chassis. It has the 7.3 IDI motor and an Allison 545 with a 4.44 diff. I plan on changing the trans to an Allison 2000 in the future. Now to the issue. Some friends and I drive from North Texas (DFW area) to North Dakota to pheasant hunt. The last two years we rented a "Super C" motorhome. We try to sleep some before it's our turn to drive. Very nice rigs but they rode like an empty box truck making it very difficult to sleep. We drive straight thru, changing drivers every four hours. I have considered adding an additional axle behind the existing axle and installing an airbag system similar to a OTR tractor setup. I do have air brakes. I think I want to do this just do improve the ride characteristics. I'm also considering converting it to four-wheel drive for other hunting/fishing trips. There are a lot of great people on this forum with a wealth of knowledge. The thing about forums (any forums) is they can get hijacked and or WAY off topic. People will chime in with negative comments or questioning your sanity (like WTF are you thinking). I find it tough to read thru the posts when that starts to happen. Please update the post or PM me if you don't mind. Sorry about the formatting.
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Old 01-11-2023, 06:50 AM   #48
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while not specifically an FE bus... International DID offer the 4900 series trucks.. which were a bit heavier version of the 4700 series in a tandem.. come to think of it ive seen a 4700 mini tank truck in a tandem also.. this is the starting point id go with.. id get ahold of the OnCommand service documentation and start looking at how the Tandem 4000 series trucks are put together...



I didnt read every post through the rest of this thread, however im simply trying to provide a starting point and perhaps some ideas on how you can achieve the frame part.. many of these bus frames were multi use rails and could possibly already have the bosses present for mounting up a second axle set... im assuming if you are considering a tandem build that you already have mecahnical skills to fab up whatever needed mods to the body are required and to use service docs to see how things like the drive system and braking systems would work..



as far as i know the tandems on the 4000 series trucks allowed both axles tio be drive axles.. im not sure if it was a full time system or selectable, ive not driven one , ive simply seen them..


again just tossing out ideas for how you could source parts or get ideas.. I definitely am in the camp that this is a very possible build to achieve, esp being on an IH chassis.



you may have already left for good.. but anyway.. a couple ideas for you.



-Christopher
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Old 01-11-2023, 06:56 AM   #49
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maja,


his 466 can easily be turned up to make real power.. the Orion by PowerHungry will put him in the 350-400HP range without any real physical mods to it.. at that point, he would need to go with an allison 3000 trans or get a Built 1000/2000, I would probably go with a 3060 that has 6th gear open and gear at probably a 5.5x ratio.. still gives you decent low end torque and a good highway speed in 6th gear (assuming he is running 11R22.5)..



in an FE bus frame you are somewhat constrained in how physically big of an engine will fit, the IC / Amtran already has a pretty monster size doghouse thats a bit of a PITA anyway.. let alone trying to go with a class-8 engine..
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Old 01-11-2023, 07:00 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sehnsucht View Post
And please DO show and tell, because if you figure it out you'll become our resident tandem skoolie expert!

One final example, if you want to look for this online. For a period in the 70s and 80s Blue Bird made their Wanderlodge RVs which were basically their school buses turned into RVs from the manufacturer. Some of these I've seen were tandem axles but I'll admit I cannot be certain they were both drive axles. The third axle may have been an unpowered tag axle which isn't really what you're looking for I know. But for as many of these as were made and as close-knit as that online community is I've no doubt if you start asking the questions they'll have far more real-world knowledge than this community on that particular subject.

were the wanderlodges true tandems or just tags? ive seen a few wanderloadges that had Single wheel Tags but not true driven tandems..
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Old 01-11-2023, 08:00 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 747mech View Post
Thank you for posting this question(s). I have a 2003 Bluebird (12 window) on a International 3800 chassis. It has the 7.3 IDI motor and an Allison 545 with a 4.44 diff. I plan on changing the trans to an Allison 2000 in the future. Now to the issue. Some friends and I drive from North Texas (DFW area) to North Dakota to pheasant hunt. The last two years we rented a "Super C" motorhome. We try to sleep some before it's our turn to drive. Very nice rigs but they rode like an empty box truck making it very difficult to sleep. We drive straight thru, changing drivers every four hours. I have considered adding an additional axle behind the existing axle and installing an airbag system similar to a OTR tractor setup. I do have air brakes. I think I want to do this just do improve the ride characteristics. I'm also considering converting it to four-wheel drive for other hunting/fishing trips. There are a lot of great people on this forum with a wealth of knowledge. The thing about forums (any forums) is they can get hijacked and or WAY off topic. People will chime in with negative comments or questioning your sanity (like WTF are you thinking). I find it tough to read thru the posts when that starts to happen. Please update the post or PM me if you don't mind. Sorry about the formatting.
An 03 would have been a t444e, not an idi. Unless someone swapped an idi in there, but highly doubt that's happened. To get it to ride better, you don't need an additional axle, just air ride on your current axle. It will ride better yet if you air ride both axles, but that's a pretty rare setup to find.

School bus suspensions have to work across a wide range of loads, and it's tough to get a spring suspension to not buck like bronco when the bus isn't loaded. You can also play with tire pressures too, depending on how loaded you are vs the capacity of the tires. Manufacturers will post charts that you can follow about deflation for less load.

TBH, what you have currently is pretty plain jane in the bus world. If I were you, I'd sell it and buy a trip bus, that's RE, md3060, w/ the air ride suspension that you're after. Or buy a coach bus and have a true highway cruiser. I'm not saying you can't make your bus work, it's just that some tools are better suited to the task at hand.
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Old 01-11-2023, 08:08 AM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
were the wanderlodges true tandems or just tags? ive seen a few wanderloadges that had Single wheel Tags but not true driven tandems..
The one time I saw one in person both axles were dual wheel which to me implies dual drive axles. Tag axles are usually only single tire. At least that's my experience.
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Old 01-11-2023, 08:28 AM   #53
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Factory Installed Drive Tandem

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
were the wanderlodges true tandems or just tags? ive seen a few wanderloadges that had Single wheel Tags but not true driven tandems..
I've only seen tags on BB WLs and I haven't found any documentation to the contrary. Maybe, idk.

Obviously, Thomas, Crown & Gillig supplied some west coast schools with Tandem transport. I've not found any which were FEs.


Thomas


Crown


Gillig


Kenworth

Has any school bus manufacturer installed Tandem drive axles onto a front engine chassis?
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