DT530 vs Cummins 8.3. too close to call?

[JasonHurst.studio]

Hello All,
Buying a 40ft diesel pusher and I am down to 2 choices and I wanted your feedback please. Both have similar milage, similar age and are in similar condition. Both have a Allison MD3060
One is a bluebird all American with a cummins 8.3
the other is an International 3000 with a DT530.
I've researched everything that I can about the two busses but wanted to tap into the wealth of knowledge on this forum. Any advice, would be much appreciated.
J

[nikitis]

Rarely a DT530 is in a bus. It is a nice engine. I’d go with that for sure. Will be able to maintenance it more too as it breaks down. Lots of power too. People always go for the dt466 because that’s the highest that’s usually offered.

[JasonHurst.studio]

Originally Posted by nikitis

Rarely a DT530 is in a bus. It is a nice engine. I’d go with that for sure. Will be able to maintenance it more too as it breaks down. Lots of power too. People always go for the dt466 because that’s the highest that’s usually offered.

Right on. Thank you for your input

[Omnibot2000]

Originally Posted by JasonHurst.studio

Hello All,
Buying a 40ft diesel pusher and I am down to 2 choices and I wanted your feedback please. Both have similar milage, similar age and are in similar condition. Both have a Allison MD3060
One is a bluebird all American with a cummins 8.3
the other is an International 3000 with a DT530.
I've researched everything that I can about the two busses but wanted to tap into the wealth of knowledge on this forum. Any advice, would be much appreciated.
J

What are the years of these buses?

[JasonHurst.studio]

Originally Posted by Omnibot2000

What are the years of these buses?

2003 and 2000

[Omnibot2000]

Originally Posted by JasonHurst.studio

2003 and 2000

And I know which engine is 2000 and 2003 how?

[JasonHurst.studio]

Originally Posted by Omnibot2000

And I know which engine is 2000 and 2003 how?

You are completely correct. I do apologize.
2000 is the dt530 and 2003 is the Cummins 8.3

[kromboy]

That's gonna be a CAPS ISC, I have one of those and I'm scared for that CAPS failure if it ever comes, and I also hear it's getting harder to find replacement parts for CAPS because it was only in production for a few years before they changed to HPCR.

Originally Posted by JasonHurst.studio

2003 is the Cummins 8.3

[JasonHurst.studio]

Originally Posted by kromboy

That's gonna be a CAPS ISC, I have one of those and I'm scared for that CAPS failure if it ever comes, and I also hear it's getting harder to find replacement parts for CAPS because it was only in production for a few years before they changed to HPCR.

Do you think it's worth avoiding the years that they made caps? 98-05?
that's a lot of busses

[Omnibot2000]

Originally Posted by JasonHurst.studio

You are completely correct. I do apologize.
2000 is the dt530 and 2003 is the Cummins 8.3

DT530 is a good solid engine, I'm sure you know from your research what its all about. Heui injection principle was used between international and CAT. The international fuel system is pretty reliable. Mostly confined to the injectors, HPOP and IDM. The engine itself is solid.

The Cummins engine, the only real big problem is the CAPS fueling system. We had one at work and it never had issues till we sold it but I worked with a guy that hated them. I will say I do not have that much experience with them. Its very expensive to repair when they fail for the parts and does require a good bit of labor to fix. My understanding the pump that feeds the caps system gets weak and kills the system. I believe there is aftermarket electric pumps for those to keep a good fuel supply feeding it to keep it alive.

Kind of goes back to the 5.9 Cummins days when the electric lift pump would die but the truck would still run. Over time the injection pump wore itself out and then you needed to replace the electric lift pump and injection pump. We ended up installing a low fuel pressure warning light on those engines so if the electric lift pump dies, the warning light would come on and the truck can be driven to the shop for repair.

Outside of the fuel system, both are fine engines but I will give the edge to the international. If I am correct both are pre emission, pre EGR even. Someone can correct me on that. I really would not run away from either one of them. When they break however, have some deep pockets ready. They are for the most part commercial engines and even though they are in a school bus, they can get very expensive to repair.

If your building a bus on a budget then it is my opinion it is not the engine for you. If you plan to travel this thing and make an epic skoolie with and money does not matter. Both of these engines are winners.

I think the deciding factor really falls on the condition of the bus overall and what gear ratios they are coming with. Check for any installed retarders as well.

[JasonHurst.studio]

Thank you very much for the reply and information. We are planning to build a full time livable skoolie and we are not cost cutting especially when it comes to the drivetrain.
As you will know, there is no perfect engine nor drivetrain. I just want to hedge my bets against needing a serious repair and if I do need a serious repair , I would like that engine to be easy to work on and possibly in frame rebuild versus what they would call a throwaway engine.

Originally Posted by Omnibot2000

DT530 is a good solid
engine, I'm sure you know from your research what its all about. Heui injection principle was used between international and CAT. The international fuel system is pretty reliable. Mostly confined to the injectors, HPOP and IDM. The engine itself is solid.

The Cummins engine, the only real big problem is the CAPS fueling system. We had one at work and it never had issues till we sold it but I worked with a guy that hated them. I will say I do not have that much experience with them. Its very expensive to repair when they fail for the parts and does require a good bit of labor to fix. My understanding the pump that feeds the caps system gets weak and kills the system. I believe there is aftermarket electric pumps for those to keep a good fuel supply feeding it to keep it alive.

Kind of goes back to the 5.9 Cummins days when the electric lift pump would die but the truck would still run. Over time the injection pump wore itself out and then you needed to replace the electric lift pump and injection pump. We ended up installing a low fuel pressure warning light on those engines so if the electric lift pump dies, the warning light would come on and the truck can be driven to the shop for repair.

Outside of the fuel system, both are fine engines but I will give the edge to the international. If I am correct both are pre emission, pre EGR even. Someone can correct me on that. I really would not run away from either one of them. When they break however, have some deep pockets ready. They are for the most part commercial engines and even though they are in a school bus, they can get very expensive to repair.

If your building a bus on a budget then it is my opinion it is not the engine for you. If you plan to travel this thing and make an epic skoolie with and money does not matter. Both of these engines are winners.

I think the deciding factor really falls on the condition of the bus overall and what gear ratios they are coming with.

[kromboy]

It's difficult to avoid because if you're looking at HPCR ISC, you only have a couple of years until they started introducing DPF etc.

One good thing about my engine is that it only has an EGR so not too many emissions things to worry about.

Given that you have a DT530 as an alternative, I'd just go with that.

Originally Posted by JasonHurst.studio

Do you think it's worth avoiding the years that they made caps? 98-05?
that's a lot of busses

[Omnibot2000]

Originally Posted by kromboy

It's difficult to avoid because if you're looking at HPCR ISC, you only have a couple of years until they started introducing DPF etc.

One good thing about my engine is that it only has an EGR so not too many emissions things to worry about.

Given that you have a DT530 as an alternative, I'd just go with that.

Did the EGR come out in 03 on those Cummins? I'm not to sure.

[kromboy]

I believe so, although I do get conflicting info on the internet some reputable sources say September 31st 2002 was the cutoff and mine was made in 2003, it sits in an 05 blue bird.

Having said that though, mine also had an after market DPF that the school district had installed and later deleted due to it causing many issues, maybe my EGR is also after market, I should really look into it so I can delete it if it didn't come stock.

Originally Posted by Omnibot2000

Did the EGR come out in 03 on those Cummins? I'm not to sure.

[Omnibot2000]

Originally Posted by kromboy

I believe so, although I do get conflicting info on the internet some reputable sources say September 31st 2002 was the cutoff and mine was made in 2003, it sits in an 05 blue bird.

Having said that though, mine also had an after market DPF that the school district had installed and later deleted due to it causing many issues, maybe my EGR is also after market, I should really look into it so I can delete it if it didn't come stock.

Would almost need pictures. If it indeed has an EGR then that would be another reason to turn away however for the most part an engine with an EGR only for emission system is generally not a deal breaker for me. It's the rest of the crap they added later on I would not want.

[kromboy]

So I did some further research, my engine is an ISC CM554, according to some cummins documents if there's an EGR there should be a P (pneumatic) or an E (electronic) designation after the CM554.

So, off I go to figure out why I was told my bus has an EGR and see if it really has one!

Originally Posted by Omnibot2000

Would almost need pictures. If it indeed has an EGR then that would be another reason to turn away however for the most part an engine with an EGR only for emission system is generally not a deal breaker for me. It's the rest of the crap they added later on I would not want.

[Omnibot2000]

Originally Posted by kromboy

so.

So, off i go to figure out why i was told my bus has an egr and see if it really has one!

lol.............

[More2See]

A 2000 International RE 3000 was just sold at the Ritchie Brothers Auction in CA this week with a DT530 in it. Went for $3,000 with 334K on it.

[JasonHurst.studio]

Originally Posted by More2See

A 2000 International RE 3000 was just sold at the Ritchie Brothers Auction in CA this week with a DT530 in it. Went for $3,000 with 334K on it.

Yeah I found mine in California. Auction ended last week. International 3000 40ft pusher , dt530, Allison 3060 with 177k miles on the clock

[Jon1371usmc]

Never had the Cummins 8.3, but I have a dt530 in my bus and love it. Plenty of power, no problem cruising at 80, also with a 5spd md3060, 5.38s in the rear axle, at around 22-2300rpms with no hunting of gears even going up moderate hills. Inframe kits are cheap as well