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Old 04-15-2021, 12:17 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
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Gear change in rear question

Hey guys I have a spicer N190 rear Iím looking to swap out my third member for a different gear set for that rear are the any interchangeable third members from other rears if so wat should I try to look out for?
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Old 04-15-2021, 12:53 PM   #2
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Originally Posted by Ironworker85 View Post
Hey guys I have a spicer N190 rear Iím looking to swap out my third member for a different gear set for that rear are the any interchangeable third members from other rears if so wat should I try to look out for?
What's your current ratio?

Generically I'd go 3.90-4.44 for a highway capable cruiser.
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Old 04-15-2021, 01:03 PM   #3
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For me, it's helpful if you provide more details about your engine, tranny (gears), current rear end ratio, bus size, what you are currently able to cruise at and what you're trying to achieve. That gives perspective to those responding.

I have a 33' IC flat nose with a T444E (230hp) and a 4 speed tranny. I had a 5.11 rear end and did 2400 rpm at 60mph. I swapped out to a 4.10 and now do 2000 rpm at 60mph.

The bus still gets up and going in traffic around town and getting on the freeway well. My climbing ability is a bit more of a struggle since I only have 4 gears and a fairly large bus. I have to work at keeping it in its power range while also watching the EGTs to not overheat.

Hope that helps.
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Old 04-15-2021, 01:07 PM   #4
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Yes I hav 444 now. Iím tryin to find wat third members will work with that spicer rear
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Old 04-15-2021, 04:37 PM   #5
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I'd call a local rear end shop and ask. Then you could also get a quote.

Part of determining what gear ratio you can use depends on your engine, tranny, bus, etc.. I had an Allison shop help me out by putting my bus info into their computer and tell me what would be an acceptable range of rear end ratios.

Just putting "whatever works with...." could be an expensive mistake.

Best of luck.
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Old 04-15-2021, 07:12 PM   #6
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weller truck parts can help you with what can swap in and part numbers.. I bought a reman 3rd member from them for my old superior that wasted its pinion gear
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Old 04-15-2021, 08:41 PM   #7
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I'd call a local rear end shop and ask. Then you could also get a quote.

Part of determining what gear ratio you can use depends on your engine, tranny, bus, etc.. I had an Allison shop help me out by putting my bus info into their computer and tell me what would be an acceptable range of rear end ratios.

Just putting "whatever works with...." could be an expensive mistake.

Best of luck.

I went to this site to determine what gear ratio to use in the "new Crown":


https://spicerparts.com/calculators/...rpm-calculator


Based on the results from this site, I determined that a gear ration of 3.42 was best for me.

The calculations told me with the 4.10 ratio the Crown came with, I would redline the engine at about 64 mph. I plan to do some driving on the western interstates where the speed limit is 70 - 80 mph. This puts the engine rpms in a comfortable range on the interstate. When I replaced the engine the HP went up 25% with about a 25% increase in torque (rpms stayed the same), while the gear ratio change was about 16.5%.
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Old 04-16-2021, 05:47 AM   #8
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Thanks very much guys that is helpful. I have a 1998 international that i cut three full windows out of the back made a new back for it to shortin it up. It has a DT466e I pulled the Allison 545 and installed a EATON 6 speed 6th gear ration is 1.00 I have 444s in the rears and 10R/22.5 tires. Bus runs very well would like to try to get a little more crusin speed out of it but donít want to go to high I built it to pull my 20í deck over with my mud truck on it
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Old 04-16-2021, 07:41 AM   #9
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Thanks very much guys that is helpful. I have a 1998 international that i cut three full windows out of the back made a new back for it to shortin it up. It has a DT466e I pulled the Allison 545 and installed a EATON 6 speed 6th gear ration is 1.00 I have 444s in the rears and 10R/22.5 tires. Bus runs very well would like to try to get a little more crusin speed out of it but donít want to go to high I built it to pull my 20í deck over with my mud truck on it

Hey that looks nice. I like your design.


1:1 trans, I'd try for the 3:4xs area like mentioned above by flattracker. If you cant find a drop in gear-head, it's not all that spendy to have someone change out the gears if you just find the right gear set.
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Old 04-16-2021, 03:41 PM   #10
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Thanks guys Iím goin to try to get ahold of spicer next week see if they can also give me any info on that N190 rear
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Old 04-16-2021, 07:22 PM   #11
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Love the battleship darker grey look and that interior is so frickin' clean! Nice job.
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Old 04-16-2021, 09:08 PM   #12
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I have an N175 axle in mine, which originally had 5.38 gears. With a 1:1 top gear (manual trans) and 10R.22.5 rubber I was turning ~2600 RPM@55MPH
I went with a 3.91 and now at 2600 RPM I'm getting around 75 MPH. In hindsight I should have gone ahead down to a 3.78


I had a not-too-far-away *TRUCK* wrecking yard do the whole swap for me - they had the parts, the techs, the tools already ... and the cost was only around $300 more than just the parts (I compared ~$1500 for a rebuilt 3rd member with desired gears + gear oil + seals + tools I don't have to do the job + my time, hassle, fuel to the gear shop - twice - + etc. to ~$1800 for a turn-key job. I did have to reprogram the computer/speedometer myself).
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Old 04-17-2021, 06:54 AM   #13
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with a 6 speed manual your ratios are somewhat close.. i would go with a 4.10 in the rear and plan on using 4th or 5th for hill climbs and that still allows you to use 6th for good highway flat travel.. it wont take your RPMs as low as the crown however you dont want to with that engine. . if you are planning on turning up the power and building the hardware in the engine for higher torque then I would consider a 3.73 but I think anything more than a 4.10 and that engine you will find yourself constantly shifting
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Old 04-17-2021, 10:16 AM   #14
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Yes I was thinking either 4.10 or 3.90 also I have been doing some messing around with different hp ecms trying to get some more power. I do like the 3.90 for cruising but like you mentioned I donít want to be constantly shifting.
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Old 04-17-2021, 10:20 AM   #15
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the god-mode service maxx can run that engine up to the standard torque 230 setting.., the high torque variants used different pistons, turbo and other internals so going above the 230 line is tough without risk of ruining the engine or seeing very little gain..
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Old 04-17-2021, 01:48 PM   #16
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Thatís the issue with these internationals the dealers are horrible will not do a thing for ya cause itís not making them big money and everything has to open a case file. I would be very happy if I could find someone wit the software needed to bring my 190 up to 230 but that is also hard to come by. So far from wat Iíve got from the dealer is the only difference between different hp 466e engines are pistons and turbo besides that all part numbers are exactly same how true that is is hard to know. I ran a 230 HT ecm in my bud a few weeks back and really woke it up but would throw a light when u got off pedal ran great under load tho
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Old 04-17-2021, 02:38 PM   #17
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If you are ever near central Ohio I can run your program up as high as you want, I just suggest not going above the 230 standard torque unless you have the bigger turbo, and 2 piece pistons, they fuel it hard on the low end in HT so your EGT goes up and the pistons take a beating with the heavy low rpm fuel unless you have the higher boost
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Old 04-17-2021, 03:27 PM   #18
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So the ST and HT both run same injectors?Is there any way I could ship a ecm to ya I am more then willing to pay to have ya program it
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Old 04-17-2021, 03:34 PM   #19
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I thought they both use B code injectors but I’d have to verify , I don’t have a way to properly bench an ECM without setting a zillion codes for missing sensors

My bus is a 444e , I’ve always just programmed them in peoples trucks / busses

One of these days I’ll get the time to build a proper bench top program station , if you have the nexiq or clone I can give you the program to do it
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Old 04-18-2021, 07:33 AM   #20
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I do have the blue nexiq box wat all would I be able to change with the software?
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