Journey with Confidence RV GPS App RV Trip Planner RV LIFE Campground Reviews RV Maintenance Take a Speed Test Free 7 Day Trial ×


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 09-22-2023, 03:48 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 12
Year: 2006
Coachwork: International
Chassis: 3000 RE
Removing California emissions equipment

Hey all! Im new and I just got our bus. Shes a 2006 International 3000 RE, DT466 7.6L. We bought it in California so its got the California emissions equipment on it. Even the head mechanic for the school district recommended removing it so I was wondering if anyone here has ever dealt with it before and is it possible to do yourself. Any help, advice, recommendations are truly appreciated. Thanks!
Attached Thumbnails
IMG_0358.jpg  

bhassett73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2023, 04:45 PM   #2
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: May 2018
Location: topeka kansas
Posts: 1,734
Year: 1954
Coachwork: wayne
Chassis: old f500- new 2005 f-450
Engine: cummins 12 valve
Rated Cap: 20? five rows of 4?
emmissions

Several you tube visible people have been prosecuted for emission removal. I suggest you do no give any internet sleuths any reason to knock on your door. Yes, some of the prosecuted people had home/ shop visits.

william
magnakansas is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2023, 05:40 PM   #3
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 18,326
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
Quote:
Originally Posted by magnakansas View Post
Several you tube visible people have been prosecuted for emission removal. I suggest you do no give any internet sleuths any reason to knock on your door. Yes, some of the prosecuted people had home/ shop visits.

william



a 2006 is a retrofit.. the EPA didnt mandate emissions in that year.. california did.. if the bus isnt in california any longer the retrofit DPF filter should be able to come off..


the EGR system on it would stay as thats factory... and when in working order shouldnt hurt anything...



from what ive seen the add-on DPF were a completely standalone system added after purchase and not by the manufacturer.. it may have a connection to the J1939 link for fueling and backpressure info but had no control over the engine operation..
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2023, 06:16 PM   #4
Bus Crazy
 
DeMac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,489
Coachwork: Integrated Coach Corp.
Chassis: RE-300 42ft
Engine: 466ci
Rated Cap: 90
We Have the Right to Refuse Service

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
a 2006 is a retrofit.. the EPA didnt mandate emissions in that year.. california did.. if the bus isnt in california any longer the retrofit DPF filter should be able to come off..


the EGR system on it would stay as thats factory... and when in working order shouldnt hurt anything...



from what ive seen the add-on DPF were a completely standalone system added after purchase and not by the manufacturer.. it may have a connection to the J1939 link for fueling and backpressure info but had no control over the engine operation..
-------------------------

This entire (debatable) subject may or may not be relevant to the entity, whom removes or refuses to remove, said equiptment. He/she must decide if the act is legal, today in 2023. Not what was required of the manufacturer, in 2006.

The shop may FA&FO for a fleet owner. But a walk-in with a bus? Smells like a fed, to me. Be sure to wear khakis & a ball cap. Lol.

Meanwhile, check out this thread:
www.skoolie.net/seek-and-destroy-bounty-epa-and-navistars-new-deal

AND....
Seach current events, in your area. Several shops have already had their hands smacked, by the EPA....

www.wthr.com/Indiana/global-xpress-parts-extra-power-performance-settle-defeat-devices-epa

www.mlive.com/11-Michigan-men-charged-in-major-us-diesel-tampering-case

www.truckpartsandservice.com/Illinois-diesel-shops-fined-600k-for-selling-emissions-defeat-devices

Seach terms:
[EPA, Diesel, Defeat, Crackdown]

See also:
(magnakansas⤴ & s2mikon⤵)
__________________
Ceiling: Framing & Electrical Rough-in
Convert Hatch to AC & Roof Patch
🇺🇸 Frederick Douglass: "If there is no struggle, there is no progress.
DeMac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-22-2023, 06:21 PM   #5
Bus Crazy
 
s2mikon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: NM USA KD6WJG
Posts: 1,271
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE 40 FEET
Engine: Cummins 8.3
As my old man once told me, "shoot, shovel and shut up." Best advise I can give you.
__________________
Why can't I get Ivermectin for my horses?
s2mikon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 12:48 AM   #6
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 12
Year: 2006
Coachwork: International
Chassis: 3000 RE
Even the head mechanic for the school district said “as soon as you get out of California, I would remove all of this stuff.”

I’m new to working around diesel engines but I’d like to try and remove it myself if possible. My goal is to learn as I can about this bus so I can keep her running great for a long time.
bhassett73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 12:25 PM   #7
Bus Geek
 
Jolly Roger bus 223's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Swansboro,NC
Posts: 2,898
Year: 86
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Ford B700
Engine: 8.2
Rated Cap: 60 bodies
check your local emissions requirements for inspections and research if removing the stuff you want will effect it passing your state/county mandated emissions inspection yearly if it is even a requirement my local county this year dropped the emission's requirement or now.
but most of my vehicles are old enough that they dont even need an inspection.
Jolly Roger bus 223 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 01:38 PM   #8
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 12
Year: 2006
Coachwork: International
Chassis: 3000 RE
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jolly Roger bus 223 View Post
check your local emissions requirements for inspections and research if removing the stuff you want will effect it passing your state/county mandated emissions inspection yearly if it is even a requirement my local county this year dropped the emission's requirement or now.
but most of my vehicles are old enough that they dont even need an inspection.
It looks like there’s only 2 counties in Indiana that require emissions testing and I’m not one of them. So I think I’m ok in that respect
bhassett73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 07:12 PM   #9
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: iowa
Posts: 1,028
Year: 1997
Coachwork: bluebird
Chassis: chevy
Engine: 3116 catapillar
Rated Cap: 71 now 2 humans 1 cat
delete these posts after your done
mmoore6856 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 08:57 PM   #10
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Sep 2015
Posts: 313
Year: 1992
Coachwork: Bluebird Mini-Bird 24'
Chassis: Chevy P30
Engine: Chevy 6.2L Diesel
The EPA is a fundamentally unconstitutional organization that needs to have its peepee smacked by a drill sergeant, if not completely "yeetus deletus" by We, The People.

Technically, it's rules may apply to commercial drivers (people who move property or people in the search of profit) through an advanced-degree of bullshit of interpretation from the 'interstate commerce' clause of the constitution.

But the EPA has massively overstepped its boundaries and needs to get put back into place, if not deleted entirely from the federal budget. The EPA has no authority over private people doing private things with their own private property.

If the EPA shows up on your doorstep, you should do the world a favor and put them in your garden. Then plant endangered species on top so that it's "illegal" to dig up. You'd do far more for the environment doing that and keeping your bus running properly and out of the landfill than any EPA investigator would--especially since they're really only after the fine money, which is why they went after the Youtubers. I guess the EPA hasn't been keeping track of how little y/t pays these days.

But the ATF also shows up to people's houses for buying oil filters, so maybe our government needs to take a good hard look at itself. And I promise that's a real, live dog in my yard, and not a tannerite-filled decoy.
Albatross is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 09:38 PM   #11
Bus Nut
 
Dbacks2k4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Iowa City, IA
Posts: 642
Year: 2006
Chassis: IC CE300 (PB105)
Engine: DT466e @245hp | Allison 3000PTS
Rated Cap: 66
2006 dt466e would have been out of the factory egr only and not had any dpf or other modern emissions crap on it. Unless something was added on as an after-the-fact retrofit to make it California compliant?

Theoretically speaking, on a pre-maxxforce dt466e with egr (approx 2005 to 2008 ) the egr could most easily be deleted by welding shut the rear side (exhaust intake) of the egr cooler and then looping around the coolant lines that pass through it externally. Or, if one were to weld both exhaust ends letting coolant continue to pass through if the cooler tubes then failed as they commonly did it wouldn't matter (you might need an extra quart or two of coolant in this scenario).

The only sensor is in the egr valve, so as long as the valve is still there and the electronics are good the ecm would have no idea it'd been blocked and thus throw no codes. The engine would look "stock" to any cursory observer.

Such modifications would be highly illegal and I would not recommend doing them
__________________
TSLABUS Build thread:
https://www.skoolie.net/forums/f11/j...ert-38328.html
TSLABUS YouTube Channel:
https://youtube.com/@thetslabus
Dbacks2k4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 09:54 PM   #12
Bus Crazy
 
s2mikon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: NM USA KD6WJG
Posts: 1,271
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American RE 40 FEET
Engine: Cummins 8.3
@ Albatross. Please don't sugar coat it. Tell us how you really feel.
__________________
Why can't I get Ivermectin for my horses?
s2mikon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 10:44 PM   #13
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: Central Kentucky
Posts: 236
Coachwork: Busless for now
Quote:
Originally Posted by Albatross View Post

But the ATF also shows up to people's houses for buying oil filters, so maybe our government needs to take a good hard look at itself. And I promise that's a real, live dog in my yard, and not a tannerite-filled decoy.
ATF is in charge of oil filters???? Sounds like you drank from the wrong barrel of Kool-Aid. And what is tannerite?
Kentucky Dreaming is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 11:11 PM   #14
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Oct 2020
Location: Near Flagstaff AZ
Posts: 1,914
Year: 1974
Coachwork: Crown
Chassis: "Atomic"
Engine: DD 8V71
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kentucky Dreaming View Post
ATF is in charge of oil filters???? Sounds like you drank from the wrong barrel of Kool-Aid. And what is tannerite?
Tannerite is a binary explosive that's sold for target shooting...it's basically ammonium nitrate and aluminum powder. And yes, the ATF has investigated people buying oil filters under the suspicion that they are being used as unregistered suppressors.
rossvtaylor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-23-2023, 11:12 PM   #15
Bus Nut
 
Dbacks2k4's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2021
Location: Iowa City, IA
Posts: 642
Year: 2006
Chassis: IC CE300 (PB105)
Engine: DT466e @245hp | Allison 3000PTS
Rated Cap: 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by rossvtaylor View Post
Tannerite is a binary explosive that's sold for target shooting. And yes, the ATF has investigated people buying oil filters under the suspicion that they are being used as unregistered suppressors.
You learn something new every day. I'm an FFL holder and get all the regular "official" communications from ATF but this one must be rather unpromoted haha
Dbacks2k4 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2023, 01:11 AM   #16
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2021
Location: Central Kentucky
Posts: 236
Coachwork: Busless for now
I just use my 9mm to discourage black bears and rednecks in the hills of southeast Kentucky. I use oil filters to keep my oil clean in my
truck and boat
Kentucky Dreaming is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2023, 11:02 AM   #17
Bus Nut
 
nikitis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2023
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 362
Year: 1995
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: T444E
Rated Cap: 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by rossvtaylor View Post
Tannerite is a binary explosive that's sold for target shooting...it's basically ammonium nitrate and aluminum powder. And yes, the ATF has investigated people buying oil filters under the suspicion that they are being used as unregistered suppressors.
LOL, do you just screw the oil filter to the tip of your pistol and fire a shot to make the hole in the bottom?
nikitis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-24-2023, 01:16 PM   #18
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Sep 2023
Location: Northern Indiana
Posts: 12
Year: 2006
Coachwork: International
Chassis: 3000 RE
Hahahaha I love the direction this is going
bhassett73 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2023, 07:46 AM   #19
Skoolie
 
Join Date: May 2023
Location: Canada
Posts: 144
Year: 2001
Coachwork: BlueBird
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: T444E, Allison 2000
Rated Cap: 72
The issue out of the whole situation is if counties or states decide to implement emission regulation and perform testing/inspection you will be caught. Regardless. Keep all your emission equipment and store it away. Had one driver here in Canada that pulled into a Kenworth dealer. They denied service. Everything was removed. Cost the driver $20000 dollars to bring it back to standard before the dealer would even look at it. More and more shops are refusing service when emission equipment is tampered. They don't want the liability.
Omnibot2000 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-27-2023, 09:57 AM   #20
Bus Nut
 
nikitis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2023
Location: South Carolina
Posts: 362
Year: 1995
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: T444E
Rated Cap: 29
Angry

Quote:
Originally Posted by Omnibot2000 View Post
The issue out of the whole situation is if counties or states decide to implement emission regulation and perform testing/inspection you will be caught. Regardless. Keep all your emission equipment and store it away. Had one driver here in Canada that pulled into a Kenworth dealer. They denied service. Everything was removed. Cost the driver $20000 dollars to bring it back to standard before the dealer would even look at it. More and more shops are refusing service when emission equipment is tampered. They don't want the liability.

I think the idea here is he wants to do the work himself, and there are still plenty of states he can get work done who do not care about emmissions. South Carolina is one such state. But I agree, they don't want to be fined or worse and is why this is happening this way.



There was a recent article from California just yesterday stating their CARB initiative was going to ban classic cars altogether due to emissions. You can bet Buses will be included in that.


https://theautowire.com/articles/rep...-classic-cars/


This is something we need to not tolerate from our local governments. They've clearly stated their goals for people like us and they want all gas vehicles off of the road by 2035. We are the carbon footprint they wish to erase. What kind of future do you want? For many these buses are our homes.


Fight back, and if you work for a dealer, YOU push back as well. Enact laws, etc. The government cannot operate if nobody supports it. Let's all stop being part of the problem and start being a part of the solution. Say NO to this when confronted, Do not comply. Change the laws.


Some battles are already being waged on this as there was an article stating that most people don't want to accept EV's and remain on Gas vehicles.

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/04/11/near...next-poll.html
https://www.businessinsider.com/amer...r-study-2023-5
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/...car-poll-shows


So they are learning that we're not going to comply with these actions, so they will try to use tactics like fining dealers who assist the people. And pricing people out of parts/vehicles/gas, or even make it scarce artificially. This is how communism works people and how it creeps into your lives. Reject it when you come across it and get mad.


If you are a dealership, you better start reading the writing on the wall. People are not going to start buying electric cars anytime soon in any kind of volume and the bulk of your repairs will be from ICE cars for the next 20 years at least. And I can't wait to see these car manufacturers suffer as a result because the majority of the cars they are making in the next 2-3 years are all electric. It will be interesting to see how this comes to a head, but people we can win this war, Speak with your wallet, do not purchase EV's simply to maintain your freedoms if nothing else.
nikitis is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:09 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.