Should I be worried about buying a bus with 16,000 hours?

[jdaugh]

Hi all, I found a used bus for sale from a private owner who bought it to do a conversion, removed almost all the seats, put new batteries in it, then had a change of heart and does not want a skoolie anymore.
2003 international with a DT466 and Allison 2000 transmission.
The odometer is broken and reads 000690.0
The hours read 016130.4
I believe it is from Tampa area.
I have read that it could be 15 to 45 miles per engine hour. Using 30, that's 480,000 mi.
Should I be concerned? Is it possible/plausible that this bus idled with a/c so much that it's more like 15 miles per engine hour? When I go to see the bus, are there any telltale signs I should/can look for of an aged engine that is in need of a major overhaul/rebuild?
Thank you in advance for any opinions on this matter. Please feel free to share your own miles per engine hour figure, especially if your bus is from a similar climate.

[fo4imtippin]

I only have my info from when my ECU was replaced while it was a bus. Based on the hours/milage ratio during bus service, my bus has 14mph average. So it has 150k miles with an estimated 10.5k hours on it. I would factor a 15mph average on your bus putting it more in line with the 250k miles that I commonly see DT466 get retired at in Florida.

[jdaugh]

That is encouraging. Thank you!

[Jolly Roger bus 223]

try to find a mobile mechanic or even a local shop to have the owner take it to.
have it checked over and a scan tool connected to verify actual mileage.
unless the computer has been replaced.
like my situation for my second bus.
the seller said it has 140,000 on it but the dash was replaced to fix guage issues and it reads 360,000 something my mobile scan tool read something completely different than either but once i got it home i found the computer had been replaced as well.
so me being me i dug into the motor with compression test and all of that before the conversion moved forward but i didnt expect anything wrong after i drove it 2 hours home on the interstate at 80 and it had more in it and wanted to go with no problems once a flat spot in a tire rounded out.
maybe ask a florida member here if they would look at it for you.

[musigenesis]

My DT466e has about 9000 hours and 158K miles, which ratio would put your engine at 280K - which might be considered a bit long in the tooth. A useful thing for any bus owner to have is a BlueFire, which is a gadget that plugs into a bus' data port (which a 2003 IC will definitely have) and will let you set up a digital dashboard on an iOS or Android device. It's a bit under $200 (use the code AMAZON on the bluefire site to get 15% off) and if you bought it before buying the bus you can also get the true mileage of the engine (bus clusters, especially IC clusters, are notoriously unreliable).

[DeMac]

What is so tempting about this heavily used bus from a low maintenance district? Is there a shortage of well maintained buses, elsewhere?

High hours, low miles does not indicate alot of idling. It indicates more braking and accelerating. Bus idling is not a common practice and is illegal in many areas.

Ex:
10k hrs / 50k miles = 5 mph avg speed
10k hrs / 350k miles = 35 mph avg speed

Hours being the same, I would choose the 350k mile bus over the 50k mile bus. Less wear-n-tear on many systems, better cooling & carbon burn-off, "evenly worn" & more likely maintained due to miles....

Our $2k Florida bus has 11k hrs/220k mi.

16k is alot of hours. Not on a Florida bus. No way. Thats alot of hours unless it's from a high maintenance Cali Valley.

[DeMac]

Duplicate Post

[jdaugh]

Thank you all for the input!
I love the Douglass quote.

[Diverdude0075]

My bus has 286k miles and 19k hours. Runs great and has the international 7.3 liter diesel. If it’s been taken care of you’ll be fine. I would expect the price to reflect higher miles/hours though. I would buy it but I’ve been turning wrenches a long time as a hobby.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by Diverdude0075

My bus has 286k miles and 19k hours. Runs great and has the international 7.3 liter diesel. If it’s been taken care of you’ll be fine. I would expect the price to reflect higher miles/hours though. I would buy it but I’ve been turning wrenches a long time as a hobby.

mine's just over 10k hours... gives me something to look forward to.. although most likely ill blow mine to pieces from tuning, tinkering, and the like long before 19k.. so then ill just build a new one and ill have 0k

[EastCoastCB]

16k is a lot of hours. Unless the bus/engine are impeccable I'd either want it CHEAP or not at all.

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by DeMac

What is so tempting about this heavily used bus from a low maintenance district? Is there a shortage of well maintained buses, elsewhere?

High hours, low miles does not indicate alot of idling. It indicates more braking and accelerating. Bus idling is not a common practice and is illegal in many areas.

Ex:
10k hrs / 50k miles = 5 mph avg speed
10k hrs / 350k miles = 35 mph avg speed

Hours being the same, I would choose the 350k mile bus over the 50k mile bus. Less wear-n-tear on many systems, better cooling & carbon burn-off, "evenly worn" & more likely maintained due to miles....

Our $2k Florida bus has 11k hrs/220k mi.

16k is alot of hours. Not on a Florida bus. No way. Thats alot of hours unless it's from a high maintenance Cali Valley.

wel said and I agree on most of it. But me- I'd NEVER buy any school bus even approaching 350kmiles. Unless of course its a Crown or Gillig.

[sportyrick]

Jdaugh while it's running look at the blow by tube and see how much smoke is coming out of it. That will tell you how much wear it has internally which is a good indicator of miles or maintenance. My C7 Cat engine in my service truck went south at 5500 hours (and smoked like the dickens through blow by tube). I bought a school bus with 8500 hours and a cracked head from overheating. Come hell or high water the driver making sure he/she got back to the shop before it quit all together. I figured this out because I got all the maintenance information and saw they quit driving it right after putting a new radiator in it (oil in coolant). After pulling the head the cylinders looked perfect so I installed a rebuilt head, had the injectors rebuilt and it runs like a sewing machine, no real blow by either. Hours are only somewhat predicative of wear, PM is the KEY to engine life.

[gabrielah77]

I wouldn't source a bus from someone who has been tinkering with it and gave up. Are you sure that "a change of heart" is the reason? Maybe they found some bad news that they're not telling you about, or maybe they screwed up some of the electronics trying to take off the lights and sign, you never know what they could have encountered or done to it. I would prefer to buy a bus directly from the school district, or at least from a dealer who bought it from the school district and hasn't messed around with it.

[Dirtdoctor]

16,000 hours is A LOT of hours. Idling or on the road.
My 1993 VOLVO LOADER has 11,000 hrs. Most diesel engines need an inframe at 10,000 hours.
Id find another bus.
Cheers