A story about a bus that wont start

[magnakansas]

I often leave my telephone number in postings. I try to help out folks that call with problems. I like being able to do this.

So Monday, this is sunday night, I get a call. Woman in portland with rear engine bus cant get it started. She has had various problems and has had mobile diesel mechanic out once or twice that I know of. She explains to me what is happening. I ask some questions. She answers some questions.

I learn that she has a Cat 3208 and being a 1990 model year bus, it is going to be an all mechanical engine. I go to you tube university and find a cat 3208 video about not starting - posted by adept ape. Adept ape is a cat diesel mechanic that posts videos about caterpillar engines and systems.

So, this particular video shows the fuel pump, primer pump, fuel filter, water fuel separator, drain petcocks, and the fuel cut off solenoid. All the stuff replated to a "crank but, no start" condition.

We go over the video together so I can point out certain things. This means we can see things together at the same time stamp and talk about what she is looking at in the video. We put together a game plan for diagnosing the problem.

She teaches her four year old enough to turn the key on and off for testing. She is on the phone with me on saturday and we go over some things. The system is priming up. I send her to looking to feel the "CLICK" from the fuel cut off solenoid. She does not get that with the key on key off. Within a few minutes she finds a wire not attached to anything, and can not find a wire attached to the fuel cut off solenoid. She fixes that and tries to start. No luck, but she does say the engine does not sound "STRONG'. Like it is not turning over as fast as it did when she started this ordeal a couple of weeks ago. I tell her that a diesel has to turn over fast enough to make hot air when cranking over or it can not ignite the fuel. She is going to put the charger on the batteries and try again on sunday at the warmest part of the day.

Today about 2 o'clock in the afternoon - her time. I receive a text. IT STARTED. That is good news. I like it when a plan comes together.

This is one of the reasons I stay on this forum. It feels good to be able help others out of that jam. So many of the people here are single working on a bus and dont seem to have any support at all. That has to suck big time. I have a lot of support - from wife, friends, and grand kids.

cheers.

william

[Kentucky Dreaming]

Wonderful story, William.

You and many other folks on here are more valuable than you know.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by magnakansas

I often leave my telephone number in postings. I try to help out folks that call with problems. I like being able to do this.

So Monday, this is sunday night, I get a call. Woman in portland with rear engine bus cant get it started. She has had various problems and has had mobile diesel mechanic out once or twice that I know of. She explains to me what is happening. I ask some questions. She answers some questions.

I learn that she has a Cat 3208 and being a 1990 model year bus, it is going to be an all mechanical engine. I go to you tube university and find a cat 3208 video about not starting - posted by adept ape. Adept ape is a cat diesel mechanic that posts videos about caterpillar engines and systems.

So, this particular video shows the fuel pump, primer pump, fuel filter, water fuel separator, drain petcocks, and the fuel cut off solenoid. All the stuff replated to a "crank but, no start" condition.

We go over the video together so I can point out certain things. This means we can see things together at the same time stamp and talk about what she is looking at in the video. We put together a game plan for diagnosing the problem.

She teaches her four year old enough to turn the key on and off for testing. She is on the phone with me on saturday and we go over some things. The system is priming up. I send her to looking to feel the "CLICK" from the fuel cut off solenoid. She does not get that with the key on key off. Within a few minutes she finds a wire not attached to anything, and can not find a wire attached to the fuel cut off solenoid. She fixes that and tries to start. No luck, but she does say the engine does not sound "STRONG'. Like it is not turning over as fast as it did when she started this ordeal a couple of weeks ago. I tell her that a diesel has to turn over fast enough to make hot air when cranking over or it can not ignite the fuel. She is going to put the charger on the batteries and try again on sunday at the warmest part of the day.

Today about 2 o'clock in the afternoon - her time. I receive a text. IT STARTED. That is good news. I like it when a plan comes together.

This is one of the reasons I stay on this forum. It feels good to be able help others out of that jam. So many of the people here are single working on a bus and dont seem to have any support at all. That has to suck big time. I have a lot of support - from wife, friends, and grand kids.

cheers.

william

+1000!!!! always feels good to get someone back on the road!!!


being single makes it really tough.. I often watch youtibe videos of people swapping engines and transmissions.. and there is like a group of 5 guys in flannels and boots lifting parts into place.. and I think.. "damn wheres my group?" it sucks having to be ONE guy doing stuff sometimes!

[TheHubbardBus]

This is a great story, and you're a good man.

Thanks for this!

[PhilipE]

I like long distance phone type repairs. I don't get dirty as long as the phone is in my hand.


Good job on helping a person out.

[Timeline]

Thanks for being around and helping out!

[Oldyeller]

Congrats on being able to help with the lady's problem. I've been watching Adept Ape since I was looking at a short bus with a 3126 several years ago. I'm not surprised his video helped you help the lady in need.

I found it interesting that a 'professional' diesel mechanic couldn't trouble shoot a mechanical engine. All a diesel engine needs to run in fuel and air.

[Jolly Roger bus 223]

and compression.
decent fuel as well

[Oldyeller]

Originally Posted by Jolly Roger bus 223

and compression.
decent fuel as well

I was bastardizing the old saying, "all an engine (gasoline) needs to run is fuel, air and spark.", and applying it to diesel which doesn't need spark.

[jimmythomas]

The spark in a Diesel engine comes from high compression.
So you need fuel, air and compression. Low/weak batteries will cause low compression because the engine can't spin fast enough on the starter motor.
Many years ago I worked in a shop that sold VW diesels, and the number one cause of poor starting was low compression. Once the little bastards started they ran fine, but getting them to start in cold weather with a crappy battery was impossible.

[Oldyeller]

Originally Posted by jimmythomas

The spark in a Diesel engine comes from high compression.
So you need fuel, air and compression. Low/weak batteries will cause low compression because the engine can't spin fast enough on the starter motor.
Many years ago I worked in a shop that sold VW diesels, and the number one cause of poor starting was low compression. Once the little bastards started they ran fine, but getting them to start in cold weather with a crappy battery was impossible.

LOL, if you want to be literal there is a long list of requirements for an engine to run but -- they're not part of the old saying I referenced. Is the problem that nobody is aware of that saying?

[rossvtaylor]

Nicely done, William - thanks for being here...and there...for others.

[Dbacks2k4]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

being single makes it really tough.. I often watch youtibe videos of people swapping engines and transmissions.. and there is like a group of 5 guys in flannels and boots lifting parts into place.. and I think.. "damn wheres my group?" !

Amen! Although where there's a will there's a way. Im sure you, like me, have found all kinds of janky and creative solutions to accomplish something that takes an hour to implement and setup when another set of hands would've just had it done...

[Jay Are]

That's a great outcome that was prolly a crisis for her. Thank you for being there to help another. And thanks to all here and to skoolie forum. This continues to be a wonderful resource, especially to a newbie like me.

[HamSkoolie]

Originally Posted by Oldyeller

LOL, if you want to be literal there is a long list of requirements for an engine to run but -- they're not part of the old saying I referenced. Is the problem that nobody is aware of that saying?

As a diesel, general auto, bus fleet, police fleet, and aviation mechanic I can tell you that without a doubt the biggest problem is that most people behind the wheel, sticks, or yoke are nothing more than AIMERS. They have little to no knowledge of how the systems work and interact. They turn the key and go. Some might actually kick the tires before turning the key.
AIMERS are the source of many posts here. How many times have we heard "i cut some wires and now my engine wont start". Or "my engine started fine before I parked it and now it wont start. The batteries have a full 12 volts".

We have written checklists to guide AIMERS through their pre and post trip inspections but a majority simply put the check mark in the box and sign the bottom line. This problem isn't usually a new AIMER issue either. It happens after an AIMER has done the checklist 100 times and never found an issue....then the tasks that are more difficult, time consuming, uncomfortable, or dirty start getting skipped because "there's never anything wrong".
Next thing you know, a mechanic is being dispatched to a broken down rig.
Not complaining, AIMERS ensure job security for mechanics. Simply pointing out that not only is nobody aware of that saying, they're not aware of how their equipment works and thus they are at the mercy of luck and mechanics.
Understanding the systems is the difference between being stranded and limping in.
1982, Waikiki Hawaii. The fuel pump in my 1965 MGB died. I drove it home, over the Pali (mountain in the middle of Oahu) with no fuel pump.....Because I understood the systems.
UNDERSTAND YOUR SYSTEMS

[LargeMargeInBaja]

Off-topic yet semi-related:
.
Speaking of telephone, how do I set this as my ringtone on my Android telephone?
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http://www.kahlenberg.com/model-kph-...ston-horn.html