Cummins 5.9 with MD3060

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

my bus with a ""Pickup truck"" engine Hauls Ass

Yep, and yours is a shorty that's been worked over with your knowledge and skills.
250hp, double overdrive, and highway gearing will do that.

[Sleddgracer]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

my bus with a ""Pickup truck"" engine Hauls Ass

.....................................

[PNW_Steve]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

my bus with a ""Pickup truck"" engine Hauls Ass

It's isn't a "pickup" engine.

It was a joint development by Case and Cummins to produce a tractor engine. It has found its way into numerous applications. It makes a fantastic boat motor.

I happen to have one in a pickup

I have run Snoqualmie pass at 55-60mph in fifth gear grossing 22k lbs.

For a full size bus that I want to travel the country in, I will stick with my 8.3.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by PNW_Steve

It's isn't a "pickup" engine.

It was a joint development by Case and Cummins to produce a tractor engine. It has found its way into numerous applications. It makes a fantastic boat motor.

I happen to have one in a pickup

I have run Snoqualmie pass at 55-60mph in fifth gear grossing 22k lbs.

For a full size bus that I want to travel the country in, I will stick with my 8.3.

mine is.. or well the 7.3 is used in pickups and MD engines..

really I was just peing a pain in the ass with that post.. I was on 4 shots of espresso at 7am...

[PNW_Steve]

The 7.3IDI, T444e and the all saw service in the medium duty applications before they found their way into pickups.

They do make great pickup engines too.

[Back To Skool]

5.9 24v ISB mated to an MD3060.

Anyone have thoughts on how underwhelming this will be pulling a 38 foot, 13 window Thomas with a GVWR of 33,350 lbs?



Driving over mountains?

[EastCoastCB]

Originally Posted by Back To Skool

5.9 24v ISB mated to an MD3060.

Anyone have thoughts on how underwhelming this will be pulling a 38 foot, 13 window Thomas with a GVWR of 33,350 lbs?



Driving over mountains?

Better than many.

[Ronnie]

Originally Posted by Back To Skool

5.9 24v ISB mated to an MD3060.

Anyone have thoughts on how underwhelming this will be pulling a 38 foot, 13 window Thomas with a GVWR of 33,350 lbs?



Driving over mountains?

What does the bus actually weigh? 33,350 is gross weight. I can tell you from pickup truck experience (with a 5.9) that I grossed out at 26,000lbs with trailer and it did very well. Add another 6,000lbs and you will be with the big trucks in the slow lane on grades. Which is not a bad thing .

[tlzimmerman]

It'll pull it just fine! Sure its a smaller displacement engine but it has plenty of power to move the bus. I'd rather have the 8.3 or the 466E too but a 5.9 is a proven engine.

Keep in mind for years trucks grossed 80000 pounds with 300 or 350 horse engines. That 5.9 is probably 190 or more depending on its rating and the bus actually weighs 20-30 tops. Sure sometimes you are going to have to gear down to climb a hill and descend a grade....but thats just territory for driving heavy vehicles. Getting in a hurry is what is hard on engines.

I do wish they sleeved them though.

Look, it seems like in these threads people want busses to move like passenger cars. I mean, throw enough power in them and they pretty much can but my 5.9 12valve bus will outpace my 500hp semi truck when i'm loaded down with grain and headed to the elevator. And....I haven't even massaged the pump yet. Might not do it either.

Its all about mindset.

[Booyah45828]

Like ronnie said, if your true weight is right at the gvwr, you'll be in the slow lane.

At the end of the day, you still only have 210 or so HP, which will be your limiting factor pulling grade.

If pulling grade at 70 is important, get a bigger engine. And then get bigger brakes too because you, more importantly, have to stop it from 70.

[RolesvilleMarina]

I've got a T444E which I keep hearing is the most underpowered

pushes the short bus down the lane at a comfortable 65 easy

I've not so far found a need for more "horsepower" yet

[Back To Skool]

Originally Posted by Ronnie

What does the bus actually weigh? 33,350 is gross weight. I can tell you from pickup truck experience (with a 5.9) that I grossed out at 26,000lbs with trailer and it did very well. Add another 6,000lbs and you will be with the big trucks in the slow lane on grades. Which is not a bad thing .

The weight of the bus, according to a chart I found on this forum, will be about 22-23,000 lbs. Then you figure a full conversion plus tanks and fluids, etc, I would guess the actual weight to be around 27,500 - 29,500 lbs when all said and done.

I don't mind being in the slow lane going up grades. This bus has the 190 HP in it. I'm comparing this bus to another with a more powerful engine (DT466E), a bit shorter chassis, but with the AT545.

[Back To Skool]

Originally Posted by tlzimmerman

It'll pull it just fine! Sure its a smaller displacement engine but it has plenty of power to move the bus. I'd rather have the 8.3 or the 466E too but a 5.9 is a proven engine.

Keep in mind for years trucks grossed 80000 pounds with 300 or 350 horse engines. That 5.9 is probably 190 or more depending on its rating and the bus actually weighs 20-30 tops. Sure sometimes you are going to have to gear down to climb a hill and descend a grade....but thats just territory for driving heavy vehicles. Getting in a hurry is what is hard on engines.

I do wish they sleeved them though.

Look, it seems like in these threads people want busses to move like passenger cars. I mean, throw enough power in them and they pretty much can but my 5.9 12valve bus will outpace my 500hp semi truck when i'm loaded down with grain and headed to the elevator. And....I haven't even massaged the pump yet. Might not do it either.

Its all about mindset.

Yeah, it's a 190 hp, and my total weight will be around 27-28k lbs.
I thought the 24v was sleeved? Or were you referring to your 12v?
What's your hp rating on your 12v?

I am actually comparing this bus to another with a bit shorter chassis and a DT466E, but it has the AT545.

Been looking for the 8.3 with (like everyone else) a 2000 or 3000 series Allison. I saw a couple sell at auction for almost $10k.

Trying to keep my budget $5k or less for the initial vehicle purchase. Nothing over 200k miles. So, I am basically looking at the "next best" in that price range.

I want a dognose, no longer than 35', but then I saw this beast close to me with the 5.9 24v/MD3060. It's a type D (flatnose), lower clearance, it's a FE in cabin, and it's beyond my desired length. All things I did not want. But alas, I am trying to keep an open mind.

But in talking to everyone over the last week, perhaps I should stick to my guns and hold out for what I really want. Feeling like a horse within the gate at this point, ready to get going!

Does anyone know if auctions dry up when moving towards fall/winter? Is it a seasonal thing?

[EastCoastCB]

cummins 5.9's aren't sleeved regardless of valve count.
The bus likely weighs between 16 and 19k lbs empty with no seats.

[Back To Skool]

Originally Posted by EastCoastCB

cummins 5.9's aren't sleeved regardless of valve count.
The bus likely weighs between 16 and 19k lbs empty with no seats.

Probably closer to the 19,000 lbs, as the chart I found listed the weight for a 78 passenger at 21,220 (it did not say if that was wet or dry weight, so I estimated closer to 22,000 for fuel and oil/coolant).

The bus in question is an 84 passenger. So I added another 1k lbs for the additional chassis and seats/sheet metal etc., getting me to about 23k lbs.

You reminded me that I forgot to subtract weight for the initial gutting. But I always err on the high side when it comes to weights.

Do the seats and other throwaways really add up to 3k lbs? That seems a bit high for some metal frames and foam padding.

[bp1791-unleashed]

my 34' thomas rear engine with cat 3126, all seats removed except driver seat, full fuel tank (-10 miles driving), with 3/4" plywood added to the flooring and a small fridge sitting around, came in at 19,340 pounds. I would probably knock off 500-800 pounds if the plywood and the original flooring were removed, and the fridge not there, maybe more. I plan to re-weigh when I get to that point, because I like having data points.

Also, I think for pulling hills, gearing and torque will matter most. just my opinion.

[EastCoastCB]

My 92 40 footer without seats or interior panels was 17.9, so 19 sounds about right.

[tlzimmerman]

I don't think any 5.9s are sleeved.

I'd take the smaller engine and better trans over the 545 any day. But I am pretty comfortable with 5.9s. After getting a bus that has a drivetrain I love I'd say if you are worried about it just stick it out til the right one comes along.

I think mine is 190. Yeah it's gonna pull the steep grades at 45 to 55 if I'm real loaded....but I'm not in that big of hurry. Ill bump the hp a bit but on long pulls I like to keep the exhaust and water both in safe ranges so I'll pull it slower anyways.

Drink a little less and stop to use the pisser one less time and you will make up the time you lost.

[cadillackid]

I like to have juice in my bus for getting on the freeway.. and for being able to turn at non-light intersections..



the little red bus can be up to 65-70 on even fairly short ramps... even if I decide to slow down and drive it 60 afterwords.. at least I wasnt fighting people not letting me merge

[Back To Skool]

All great points. Thanks everyone! Based on what I've read here, I don't think I will rule out the 5.9/3060 combo for mountain driving, but I also don't think it's my first choice.


Just a quick reiteration from my post above cause I'm real curious on this:

Does anyone know if auctions (govdeals, purple wave, public surplus, etc) dry up when moving towards fall/winter? Is it a seasonal thing? Or is there no rhyme or reason?