exhaust manifold advice please

[turf]

my exhaust manifold from a '93 cummins 5.9 has cracked.

i've patched it with an epoxy, but expecting the worst, i've been looking for a replacement manifold.

cummins quickserve indicates the part number to be: cummins 3921704

googling that number i see some used manifolds that look like their correct but nothing new.

there seems to be 2 styles to the exhaust manifold, a center discharge and an offset discharge. my '93 cummins is the offset discharge.

in new manifolds i see a new '93 dodge manifold is the wrong one. it's the center one. the 2003-05 dodge manifolds look right but that's 10 years difference in production dates.

here are some of my wrong year but looks right choices:

aFe Ductile Iron Exhaust Manifold for 03-07 Dodge Cummins 5.9L Diesel 46-40012

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Exhaust-Mani...3D172194412371

so if there any cummins experts on here, i'd sure listen. are they interchangeable?
thanks

[Rameses]

You can use the newer manifolds with no problem.

12 valve and 24 valve 5.9s had the same exhaust manifold bolt pattern on the head, but the 24 valve had larger exhaust ports. Consequently, putting a 12 valve manifold on a 24 valve motor will create a serious loss in power. Putting a 24 valve manifold on a 12 valve motor however, will create slightly less efficiency due to a difference in port matching, but there won't be any restriction and there isn't enough of a power decrease to tell any difference from the driver's seat.

The 24 valve did go into production in 1989 though, so if you have one of those (chances are slim) the newer Dodge manifold is actually the correct one.

Makes sure the outlet on the manifold is the same as yours before you buy it though. I'm not sure what turbo you have.

[frank-id]

Many welding shops can weld your manifold. Some small colleges and other schools can repair for a low cost. There is welding rod for cast iron.. Frank

[turf]

thank you.

my turbocharger part # from the quickserve site is : 3802272

looking up the turbo charger number i see it was the part number for '92 and '93 cummins and then again for the 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007 cummins. i think that is going to work. thank you.

[turf]

Originally Posted by frank-id

Many welding shops can weld your manifold. Some small colleges and other schools can repair for a low cost. There is welding rod for cast iron.. Frank

very true!

i picked epoxy for the first repair over welding. with the epoxy i didn't have to remove the manifold. if i have to remove it, i'll just replace it. grinding out the epoxy may not leave much manifold left to repair.

my next road trip (skooliepaloza) will give the epoxy a workout enough to see how urgent replacing the manifold is. fingers crossed the epoxy holds.

[Tango]

With the right rod (or wire) welding cast iron is not that tricky and as often as not, it can be done in place.

One trick is to do the cutaway grinding with the engine running. Does two things...1. keeps any dust or shavings out of the motor, and...2. preheats the metal.

Then too, there is always the junkyard for cheap replacement parts.

[turf]

new manifold came today

[cadillackid]

NOT a Cummins, a DT-360, but exhaust manifold related so ill ask here..

what are the caveats to removing and reinstalling a Turbo?

on my carpenter I believe manifold gasket is bad... when I got the bus there were 2 bolts in the manifold missing, i replaced the bolts but i still have a small but annoyimng exhaust leak onkly above 1/2 throttle.. im guessing the gasket got destoryed as those bolts probably slowly worked out and fell off over time before I had the bus..

since my turbo is connected to the manifold it will have to come off to gain access to 2 bolts that are covered by it.

so it looks like theres 2 oil lines to the turbo, a V-band clamp to a down pipe, and the 4 bolts that hold the turbo to the manifold and then the inlet and outlet pipes on the compressor side..

I have the gaskets for the manifold to head, the turbo to manifold and for the oil line..

do you have to do anything special to the turbo before you put it back on? or just bolt it up and start the engine?

im thinking since i and that bus are down here in florida for the winter where its warm but not hot weather makes for a good time to change that and maybe the downpipe since i know the V-band leaks a little as anytime I clean it and put it back on theres soot on the inside of the clamp.

-Christopher

[turf]

i'm all ears. if someone wants to edjumacate me, i'm listening.

my manifold also bolts straight on to the turbo charger. in the picture, the manifold is upside down, those 4 holes align with the turbo. 2 holes are threaded, 2 are not. i assume they bolt from different directions.

i'm not going to remove the turbo unless i break it or see serious wear when its opened up.

i hope its as easy as unbolting the old and putting in the new. if the stars align just right, i'll do it this weekend, otherwise it'll wait until after skooliepalooza.

[cadillackid]

I was goingto go to Skooliepalooza but once dred was oput I kinda lost interest.. I will go to the florida meet-up..

I guess I do have an advantage if I break the DT-360 changing the manifold I'll go to ohio and get the Bluebird lolol.. thus fsar it seems to run good..

-Christopher

[turf]

yesterday i sprayed all the studs with some wd-40. today i tried to break open a nut and the first one i tried went......snap!

they got another dose of wd-40 and i'll try again tomorrow.

grrrrrrrrr

[cadillackid]

rath than torque on them with a long handle.. try putting a somewhat shorter handle on it and then hitting the handle with a hammer if you can... impact often loosens things better than a long handle can.
exhaust bolts love to break from all the heat and rust over the years..
-Christopher

[turf]

hmmm, maybe i'll drag out the air compressor and try the impact wrench, tomorrow. the box wrenches are a tight fit. a couple of wobbles and extensions may be the ticket.

[cadillackid]

if you can get an impact in there thats the way to go... be sure to use impact sockets.. (6 point) or youll round the heads right off..

I had the opposite issue.. 2 of my bolts were missing .. 4 others took at least 1/2 turn to tighten and the 2 front ones were actually somewhat snug..

my bus had a Reman engine installed in it in like 2005 so whoever did it must have not been strong.. and the schools just ran the bus with loose of missing bolts.. .

-Christopher

[turf]

i got most of the bolts out of the engine block today. the impact wrench was the trick.

now, it does look like i'm going to have to pull the turbo with the manifold. if i unhook the oil line, and the hose clamps, i should be able to take the turbo and manifold off in 1 piece. then try and separate the manifold and turbo on the bench.



i'm glad i got a new manifold. i see this one cracking in a spot i hadn't seen before.

[SDR76]

If you have your turbo off, could you verify the exhaust housing size? It should be cast into the metal on the INSIDE of the exhaust port. I am curious if they ran a 18.5 CM or a smaller 12 or 14 cm. I have the same engine/bus. (I am assuming it has a Holset Hc1 turbo).

[DoubleO7]

Try using PB Blaster to loosen rusted up fasteners.
Or a 50/50 mix of acetone and ATF.

And when reinstalling the exhaust manifolds, I always use hardened steel studs of proper length(s) along with a hardened steel washer and then brass nut.

Then the reinstall is a breeze as your not trying to keep the gasket(s) lined up as you fiddle the manifold into position in order to get a bolt or two started.

And if you ever have to take the manifold off again, the nut will come off without twisting the stud off.

[turf]

removal complete! it got cold and i'm moving slowly now!

i didn't see the tag on the turbocharger yet. my cummins quickserve calls the turbo Holset WH1C. W for the wastegate.

the stamp on the exhaust inlet says 14.



here is the whole turbocharger..




and when i brought the manifold inside, my epoxy repair chipped right off. (did i say it was cold?) and if you look real close, you can see another hairline crack on the opposite side of the down tube.

[SDR76]

Yes. I thought it would be bigger than 14. I'd call that a win, it should spool up faster. I've not checked mine, but the one on my truck was 18.5 and I switched to a 12. It made a huge difference in drivability.

[turf]

cool! thats one good thing.

now for the bad news. wrong manifold



the other new problem as i examine the turbo charger, it looks like there is some fresh damage to the impellers.....probably a result of trying to do the repair on the vehicle.




clean it up and call it good? or do i need to do something about the damage?
new turbos aren't cheap - except some chinese ones i found