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Old 08-08-2019, 08:08 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
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Year: 1999
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Brake lights, turning signals, door not working

I'm sure many have opened up with this line but all my electrical items where working fine until they weren't. My headlights work, my running lights turn on. My tail lights, turning signals/hazard lights, and my electric door motor stopped working all at once.

I'm taken a peak inside a the fuse panel and have checked every relay and fuse. They all seem to be receiving power. Whether or not any fuses or relays are bad I am unsure. I had a friend press on the brakes to check to see if the lights are getting power and I didn't get any readings.

I'm not sure which fuses go to my lights and door and which relay as well. The door I'm not really worried about. It closes when I press the button but doesn't open. I just added this to my thread thinking maybe somehow it's all related.

Not sure if it's related at all but the main solenoid gets super hot. Then the relays I circled also are extremely hot. Not sure what's going on there.

Also, the silver fuses I've never seen before. I'm not sure how to test them and am wondering if I can replace them with regular plastic fuses.

Any help would be appreciated!
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:12 AM   #2
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I believe those silver fuses aren't actually fuses, they're circuit breakers. They are designed to trip the circuit open in the event of a short, but not destroy themselves in the process. Any one of them could be tripped open, whether for a good reason, or not.

Anything electrical getting extremely hot is no bueno. Some warmth is normal, but not like you're describing. Sounds like you may have a wiring or ground problem. Is the problem isolated to the rear, or does it affect your front flashers as well?
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:16 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHEESE_WAGON View Post
I believe those silver fuses aren't actually fuses, they're circuit breakers. They are designed to trip the circuit open in the event of a short, but not destroy themselves in the process. Any one of them could be tripped open, whether for a good reason, or not.

Sounds like you may have a wiring or ground problem. Is the problem isolated to the rear, or does it affect your front flashers as well?
Oh interesting. I wonder if there is a way to reset them...

The problem is all around. Front rear and the small ones ones on the side.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:21 AM   #4
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Its probably a bad body solenoid you have circled. I have a new one in the box if you need one. They're "White Rodgers".
I've had them go out on a couple buses.
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:29 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by EastCoastCB View Post
Its probably a bad body solenoid you have circled. I have a new one in the box if you need one. They're "White Rodgers".
I've had them go out on a couple buses.
Bad BODY solenoid? *smh* What are they going to think of next? The people that come up with this BS should have to live with their brain-childs for a few years, especially when they have these kinds of problems...
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Old 08-09-2019, 05:34 AM   #6
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Originally Posted by CHEESE_WAGON View Post
Bad BODY solenoid? *smh* What are they going to think of next? The people that come up with this BS should have to live with their brain-childs for a few years, especially when they have these kinds of problems...
yeah there's usually one for starting and one for the accessories.
easy enough to check and replace. Everyone should have an extra, IMO!
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Old 08-09-2019, 07:41 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by EastCoastCB View Post
yeah there's usually one for starting and one for the accessories.
easy enough to check and replace. Everyone should have an extra, IMO!
How do I check it? Can you text me how much you want for one. I want to replace it regardless.
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Old 08-09-2019, 10:21 AM   #8
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How do I check it? Can you text me how much you want for one. I want to replace it regardless.
If the solenoid is working it will click fairly loudly when you power it up. But note there are usually 2 of them so make sure you check for both if so.
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Old 08-09-2019, 12:41 PM   #9
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To the Op,


You seem to have a number of hot spots as shown by the browning on the connection points. Not sure why or what systems they might relate to from this vantage point.


There are a lot of frayed connection points also, poor installation from stripping wires for connection. This allows corrosion to set up which will heat connections up.


There is a nut missing on one connection in the first pic. What's up with that?


I think it is time to disconnect the batteries and go over your entire electrical panel as for cleaning and tightening and making new connections where necessary.


That larger solenoid may or not be ok but it is feeding a breaker to the right of it and that is badly corroded and feeding upwards to the HSR not sure what that is, but needs attention.


There is probably stuff I missed but generally this maintenance should be done now if you plan on travelling soon.


You showed a silver breaker in one of the pics. Take a look beside it at the wire that feeds that breaker. Bad connection there for sure and might be one source of your troubles.


If you do take these things apart I suggest making pics and notes of what went where.


Good luck


John
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Old 08-09-2019, 01:15 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJohn View Post
You seem to have a number of hot spots as shown by the browning on the connection points.

There are a lot of frayed connection points also, poor installation from stripping wires for connection. This allows corrosion to set up which will heat connections up.

I think it is time to disconnect the batteries and go over your entire electrical panel as for cleaning and tightening and making new connections
*stands and applauds*
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Old 08-09-2019, 04:03 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJohn View Post
To the Op,


You seem to have a number of hot spots as shown by the browning on the connection points. Not sure why or what systems they might relate to from this vantage point.


There are a lot of frayed connection points also, poor installation from stripping wires for connection. This allows corrosion to set up which will heat connections up.


There is a nut missing on one connection in the first pic. What's up with that?


I think it is time to disconnect the batteries and go over your entire electrical panel as for cleaning and tightening and making new connections where necessary.


That larger solenoid may or not be ok but it is feeding a breaker to the right of it and that is badly corroded and feeding upwards to the HSR not sure what that is, but needs attention.


There is probably stuff I missed but generally this maintenance should be done now if you plan on travelling soon.


You showed a silver breaker in one of the pics. Take a look beside it at the wire that feeds that breaker. Bad connection there for sure and might be one source of your troubles.


If you do take these things apart I suggest making pics and notes of what went where.


Good luck


John
I have been thinking about switching out some of the wires. It would make me feel alot better to go in there and clean things up. Any solvents or tools you suggest to help with the task?

The nut missing I'm not sure of. I just noticed it when this problem started. I'm wondering if it's always been like that or if it got loose from vibrations.

The whole panel is screwed on to an old piece of plywood. I kind of want to change that too but am not sure what would make a good substitute.

Either way thank you for the insight! When I get a moment this weekend I'll start pulling it all apart. And yes I will take plenty of pictures beforehand.
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Old 08-10-2019, 02:16 PM   #12
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Update for curious parties.

I found small fuse panel under the steering column (duh). There are a few fuses that look suspect. The one that I was most suspect about was label "turn b/u" It had a 20amp fuse where it was labeled 15a. I suspect the previous owner had problems with this already. I put in a 15amp fuse and the put on the turning signal. The dashboard showed a green arrow which it hadn't before and it was clicking. I put it to the right side and it blew. There are two flasher relay and I wonder if one might be bad? I did notice that they are both 552 flashers and I have LED lights for brakes. I bought two Novita EL12 (heavy duty electronic flashers meant to power up to 10 lights--both LED and incandescent)

I few things to mention is that it has been raining quit a bit and I have a feeling that this area is getting moisture or even wet. Its the lowest post near a leak I have in the windshield. I slapped a bunch of black UV silicon around the windshield hoping to stop the leak. The rubber gasket needs to be replaced. Its not terrible but it has a few spots that are broken.

The area itself is pretty dirty. One of the flashers has a little corrosion on it.

Am I on the right track or do you folks think there is a bad ground somewhere?

PS that red wire dangling on its own leads to an old switch that looks to have been cut out and replaced (I'm pretty sure).
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Old 08-12-2019, 04:02 PM   #13
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Exclamation

So that panel I took a picture of had nothing to do with it. Taking it apart and cleaning off all the "corrosive" bits only led me to not have A/C. I think I know the culprit for that...thanks for the suggestion though! Only cost me about a hundred dollars in parts and 2 days and a half days...

Anyways it was my passenger side mirror. In an attempt to clear up all the leaks I took it apart before that and noticed that a ground had detached. I hooked it up and my automatic mirrors worked again! For whatever reason when that grown is connected it will blow fuses. So...I'm disconnecting it and covering it and not having automatic mirrors on the right side. End of story. Good luck to anyone else who reads this and is trying to troubleshoot. My only suggestion to you is to CTRL Z (undo) any electrical changes you've made no matter how minute and see if it helps the situation.

Things I learned. The little silver fuses are in fact circuit breakers and you can find them at Autozone/discount auto. They have ones labeled for 'ford' and they have ones where you can break off the ends to make them the size you need (universal breakers). https://shop.advanceautoparts.com/p/...E&gclsrc=aw.ds

HSR/MSR/CR/CLR all refer to the air conditioning system. HSR= High speed relay. MSR= Medium Speed Relay. CR- Condenser relay CLR- CLutch Relay .

The difference between a 4 pole and a 3 pole solenoid is the 3 pole will be grounded to the body of the vehicle directly. The 4th pole on the solenoid will be for hooking up the grounding wire to your electric system or to the body I suppose. Don't quote me on that.

The solenoid in the pictures I posted are Continuous Duty solenoids vs a starter solenoid. You can pry back the tabs and open them and clean them out. For mine I had to heat up tabs that were soldiered into place. The casing up top is made of plastic so over tightening it will most likely cause it to break . Mine was in fact an old white rodgers and when I opened it all the contact points where dirty and the inside was just as rusted as the outside.

Something random I thought of is if you are troubleshooting blown fuses-go to a junk yard and pull as many fuses from those panels. Fuses can get pricey really quick and if you are blowing through them you might as well get em cheap...or free if you know what I mean.

If you find the model number for your A/C unit you can usually find a diagram of what the manufacturer suggests for installation. Mine was a little different from their but it helped quit a bit.

The two flasher relays I was referring to were for the flashers but one is for hazards and one is for the turning indicators. I have noticed that the electronic ones keep my indicators blinking a more normal rate (the older ones would click really slowly)

I think that's all the 'knowledge' I can pass on. Be well and good luck!
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Old 08-12-2019, 04:42 PM   #14
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Best of luck to you on your journey, man!
Give us a holler when you're back in FL. Me and Roxy always love to see you.
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Old 08-17-2019, 05:54 PM   #15
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By any chance did you disconnect or interior the back door emergency alarm? If so, connect it back to its original condition and see if everything works again. I had this problem w my shorty and I found out it's a little factory trick to prevent the operation of the vehicle if there's no alarm to alert the back door being open for children to fall out of!
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