AC on the road

[Big Island Kokua]

Originally Posted by SSPAdventures

We are gutting it and doing subfloor and wall insulation, we are removing 7 windows iirc, and definitely insulating the firewall and step area. I know any insulation makes a big difference.

I gutted my 4 window bus, took it all the way down to the support beams! I replaced the sheet metal on the floor and reused the rubber flooring for sound proofing where the metal meets the supports. I then put a layer of Dynamat over the sheet metal, on the walls, ceiling. firewall and the engine cover... what a huge difference!
I then followed up with 1” rigid insulation on the floor and ceiling, having a 3/4” space between the rigid and rough framing allowed me to finish off with a layer of reflectix. I’m in hawaii and insulation is the base to a quiet and cool bus... I hope this was helpful!
it may be over kill but i’ll be comfy either way!

[Sehnsucht]

Originally Posted by Mudhutwarrior

We have a winner!






Next to impossible to add enough BTU's in a bus for transit if not already equipped.
I looked into it and closest I could come to something with enough capacity would be from Thermoking and diesel powered.
I guess you could bolt a trailer unit to the back of the bus but then you would have draft issues underway with the condenser. Would look pretty radical though.

I keep thinking how this may be feasible although maybe not go as large as the unit for a 53-foot reefer - maybe the smaller unit off of a refrigerated box truck. If it's designed to keep an insulated box at zero degrees then it should have no trouble achieving 70-75 degrees in a reasonably insulated bus. I do think the duct work could prove challenging though to ensure even distribution throughout the bus.

[Bon Voyage]

I ran one of my 13,500 btu a/c’s off my generator while driving last summer in Oregon and Washington and it helps. My bus is spray foamed and rear engine so that helps. It didn’t make a huge difference but any bit helps and especially if the breeze is on you. However I was mostly fine that summer with the driver fan blowing on me. And I will say most motorhomes are terribly insulated unless you’re buying a unit that was hundreds of thousands $$$ when new. Though they are better insulated than a factory bus.

If you want to run a 13,500 btu a/c off a alternator you’d need close to a 2000watt (12 volt/170) amp alternator; or supplement with solar... A 2000 running watt inverter with surge should be ok starting the unit. I’m not sure how long the alternator would last being run close to full load for long periods... I can run 2 13,500 btu units off my 3000w inverter though not for long before the batteries die.
Also to wire in the air con you’d need a 20 amp 120 volt circuit.

[Ronnie]

I am happy with running my front rooftop a/c from the generator to keep me cool. I did put a curtain right behind it so I am only cooling the front third of the bus. I did also insulate both sides of the firewall, and seal all air leaks that I could.

[WIbluebird]

My plan is to have a 12k mini split mounted on the front bulkhead of my 40' pusher powered by my 3500w inverter generator while driving. I will have a side hallway with a curtain so it blocks off the first third of the bus. That combined with window delete and 2 inch spray foam should help.

Not to mention I am in Wisconsin where it goesn't get above 80 degrees very often in the summertime. The humidity does magnify it to some degree though.

[Kubla]

Hope you have a 200 amp alternator

[kidharris]

Originally Posted by Sehnsucht

I keep thinking how this may be feasible although maybe not go as large as the unit for a 53-foot reefer - maybe the smaller unit off of a refrigerated box truck. If it's designed to keep an insulated box at zero degrees then it should have no trouble achieving 70-75 degrees in a reasonably insulated bus. I do think the duct work could prove challenging though to ensure even distribution throughout the bus.

Freezer systems are a completely different design from air conditioning. Keeping well insulated small spaces really cold is a lot different. In refrigeration you are removing a small amount of heat down to a very low temp. Air conditioning is very different - compressor, refrigerant, and coil requirements don't match. Do AA fueler funny cars make good cars to pull freight with, they certainly have enough power, but the gearing, tires, and suspension requirements don' match? Not to mention the engine would be toast in the first hour. Similar proposition.


A small engine driving a compressor/compressors from a dead school bus using the evaporator and condenser coils from the same dead bus would work, although you would have to figure out the horsepower requirements. If cadilackids 120,000 btu estimate is correct then you would need at least a 50 horsepower engine (marginal, I think 120,000 btu = 47+ hp, diesel if your bus engine is also diesel. Maybe a 55 hp 1600 dual port VW air cooled engine would work better? Light colored, light weight (cotton or straw) hats help tremendously


Too much for me, think I'll just open the window and use a damp rag or spritzer bottle if I get too warm while driving. A small swamp cooler with an open widow at the back of the bus to let the humidity flow out (air has to be able to go out with water evaporative cooling) would also work, especially in the desert - it would freeze me out. A lot simpler, easier, cheaper, the insulation doesn't matter, and a lot less maintenance. Are you guys rich?


There is a reason snow birds go north in the summer... I say, if you can't go north then learn how to deal with the heat.... how did your great grandpa do it? Start acclimating your self every spring, I get to the point where 80 degrees F feels cold to me every summer so I set the house thermostat to 80 - 90 (this causes problems/arguments if you are living with idiots or some kids). I wear light weight, loose, long sleeve shirts out doors all summer, especially in the sun, it keeps the sun off of your skin and when it gets wet it acts like a water evap cooler, helps a lot.


Indoors I shed clothes and use a fan pointed at me if I get hot. If the out door temp is cooler than inside I try to take advantage of thermal mass by circulating out door air thru the house at night to cool it down using open, screened windows (farthest from the fan) and a ceiling mounted exhaust fan. If the wind is blowing, open all of the windows and take advantage of it. Else I use the ac at night when it is most efficient. I have very little insulation but night cooling keeps the indoors much more tolerable (even for the idiots) most of the day while the ac is off. Turn off the fan/ac when the sun comes up, a auto timer or alarm will help.

[Sehnsucht]

Good to know. I guess I can now put that flight of fancy out of my mind.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by numinousbus

Never drive through the desert in july and august. Even a car gets kind of toasty. If your going to attempt it, do it at night!

I ran my DEV bus from Ohio to Alabama , MS, Georgia, through central Florida and down to key west end of July early aigust.. actual temp was 100 a lot of the time and humidity was high.. dew points in the upper 70s.. non tinted windows and 75,000 BTU of AC cooling the front half of the Bus.. engine temp never hit 200.. I never sweated.. I retrofitted that bus with custom dash air that blows directly on me.. and installed a cabinet with AC gear behind me.. dynamatted and reflectix the firewall and floor of driver area.. sealed up all the cracks in the body mate to chassis area.. new door seals.. otherwise the bus is home stock.. still has seats and original windows ceiling etc..
AC was pushing air in the 40-43 degree range at the vents .. water drain was like a faucet.. that’s on a single Sanden enhanced HD7 compressor. I put a clear shower curtain halfway back to help keep the cool air up front on the hottest days.. that bus never had factory AC. So you can definitely add it. But take the time to do it right.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by kidharris

Freezer systems are a completely different design from air conditioning. Keeping well insulated small spaces really cold is a lot different. In refrigeration you are removing a small amount of heat down to a very low temp. Air conditioning is very different - compressor, refrigerant, and coil requirements don't match. Do AA fueler funny cars make good cars to pull freight with, they certainly have enough power, but the gearing, tires, and suspension requirements don' match? Not to mention the engine would be toast in the first hour. Similar proposition.


A small engine driving a compressor/compressors from a dead school bus using the evaporator and condenser coils from the same dead bus would work, although you would have to figure out the horsepower requirements. If cadilackids 120,000 btu estimate is correct then you would need at least a 50 horsepower engine (marginal, I think 120,000 btu = 47+ hp, diesel if your bus engine is also diesel. Maybe a 55 hp 1600 dual port VW air cooled engine would work better? Light colored, light weight (cotton or straw) hats help tremendously


Too much for me, think I'll just open the window and use a damp rag or spritzer bottle if I get too warm while driving. A small swamp cooler with an open widow at the back of the bus to let the humidity flow out (air has to be able to go out with water evaporative cooling) would also work, especially in the desert - it would freeze me out. A lot simpler, easier, cheaper, the insulation doesn't matter, and a lot less maintenance. Are you guys rich?


There is a reason snow birds go north in the summer... I say, if you can't go north then learn how to deal with the heat.... how did your great grandpa do it? Start acclimating your self every spring, I get to the point where 80 degrees F feels cold to me every summer so I set the house thermostat to 80 - 90 (this causes problems/arguments if you are living with idiots or some kids). I wear light weight, loose, long sleeve shirts out doors all summer, especially in the sun, it keeps the sun off of your skin and when it gets wet it acts like a water evap cooler, helps a lot.


Indoors I shed clothes and use a fan pointed at me if I get hot. If the out door temp is cooler than inside I try to take advantage of thermal mass by circulating out door air thru the house at night to cool it down using open, screened windows (farthest from the fan) and a ceiling mounted exhaust fan. If the wind is blowing, open all of the windows and take advantage of it. Else I use the ac at night when it is most efficient. I have very little insulation but night cooling keeps the indoors much more tolerable (even for the idiots) most of the day while the ac is off. Turn off the fan/ac when the sun comes up, a auto timer or alarm will help.

I don’t go all 1943 .. this is 2020, build a climate control system that keeps the inside whatever climate anyone desires.. my house is 1400 sq ft and has 3 climate zones.. no thermostat wars or sweater wearing or clothes shedding here.. tell Alexa to set the temp and humidity and she obliges

[Native]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

I don’t go all 1943 .. this is 2020, build a climate control system that keeps the inside whatever climate anyone desires.. my house is 1400 sq ft and has 3 climate zones.. no thermostat wars or sweater wearing or clothes shedding here.. tell Alexa to set the temp and humidity and she obliges

You go, Christopher! You always have the finest air conditioning systems in your buses and home. I always like the wonderful advice you give from your vast knowledge of the subject. Thank you.

[kidharris]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

I don’t go all 1943 .. this is 2020, build a climate control system that keeps the inside whatever climate anyone desires.. my house is 1400 sq ft and has 3 climate zones.. no thermostat wars or sweater wearing or clothes shedding here.. tell Alexa to set the temp and humidity and she obliges

"1943" is only a flip of the switch away. What can I say, Alexa is not much help out here.



I have different temperature zones in my house, but only one climate zone. I'm impressed, very few states even have 3 climate zones.



Because I am acclimatized I do have an additional benefit though... If I breakdown and have to walk or the power goes out, I am mostly likely not going to die of heat exhaustion or be all that uncomfortable and don't require as much artificial climate support as most modern US city dwellers. Don't get me wrong, I like my ac but as long as I have water and, hopefully, shade I will be somewhat comfortable even when it is above 100 degrees.


If Amazons digital "Alexa" can mess with your temperature and humidity, how many other entities can also? Sounds too fragile and out of control for me, I'm not an IT pro like you.

[Mudhutwarrior]

Never ceases to amaze me that people would want a microphone installed in their house so anyone can listen. Now its cameras too. And they pay for it to boot.



I wouldn't trust anyone who would do that with sound judgement ever.

[Sehnsucht]

Originally Posted by Mudhutwarrior

Never ceases to amaze me that people would want a microphone installed in their house so anyone can listen. Now its cameras too. And they pay for it to boot.



I wouldn't trust anyone who would do that with sound judgement ever.

No kidding, right?! The government would love to have as much surveillance on us as corporations have already and we paid them for the privilege of being spied on 24/7. Big brother is watching.

Sorry for the off-topic rant.

[kazetsukai]

Originally Posted by kidharris

"1943" is only a flip of the switch away. What can I say, Alexa is not much help out here.

As in, how reliable is that? I dunno, I myself have become more hesitant to use the AC simply because acclimating is less painful in the event something doesn't work. I do have a split in my build, but its really there to keep extreme temps at bay for the sake of what else is in the build. I hope to acclimate a little more as I go on.

Originally Posted by Mudhutwarrior

Never ceases to amaze me that people would want a microphone installed in their house so anyone can listen. Now its cameras too. And they pay for it to boot.

Yeah... I was rocking an iPaq before the iPhone, using mobile internet on my PDA via dial up (corded) long before people were doing it wirelessly today. I've been a huge techie my whole life. People signing up for these things are going to get more than they bargained for at some point down the road, it is only a matter of time.

Once the evangelists get burned, hard, by privacy violations, once the full facts around collection, retention and parsing are finally exposed to the public- then and only then will decentralized, cryptographic solutions will begin to appear that keep the consumer in control. Then, maybe I'll adopt something along those lines. In the mean time I doubt its proponents will stop marching full speed into the arms of Big Brother and I wont be one of victims.

I am trying to build my own voice recognition stuff using https://cmusphinx.github.io/ into my control hub, so I'm not some technophobe either. I just know where the Alexa/Siri/HeyAlphabet road ends. It doesn't end well.

[kidharris]

Originally Posted by kazetsukai

As in, how reliable is that? I dunno, I myself have become more hesitant to use the AC simply because acclimating is less painful in the event something doesn't work. I do have a split in my build, but its really there to keep extreme temps at bay for the sake of what else is in the build. I hope to acclimate a little more as I go on.

I found that I have to set min and max temps to prevent some problems with liquids and other products (a root cellar/basement would solve the problem, but is not mobile). I bought a small refrigerator with a higher temp range, no freezer, to keep my medications in.

Also, I am lazy. If acclimatization was hard, I probably wouldn't do it.

Originally Posted by kazetsukai

I am trying to build my own voice recognition stuff using https://cmusphinx.github.io/ into my control hub, so I'm not some technophobe either. I just know where the Alexa/Siri/HeyAlphabet road ends. It doesn't end well.

I think tech and the industrial complex is great and would not want to live without it. Without it, life would be much harder.


That said, there is just too many ways that it is being used by unscrupulous people, corporations, and governments for money, control, and power. You need to be vigilant or you become a contributor and/or a victim.


Also, complexity breeds failure (and expense). When it fails it can cause you much misery or death if you depend on it or have allowed it to weaken you enough. Most modern tech involves electronics which, of course, doesn't work without electricity. I guess I've witnessed too many power failures (dc and ac) to want to depend on electricity to stay alive if I don't have to.


Every time there is a major ac power failure in a big city, people die.

I tend to favor low tech......if it will get the job done.

When choosing low tech vs high tech/electronics-software: If I can fix it alongside of the road then it gets extra points. If one lasts forever gets even more points. Example: I prefer hand operated windows over electric window and door/trunk locks in my 4x4 because there is less that can go wrong and I can still get the window/doors to work even if it fails. A battery/wiring problem causes a failure of all of them at once.



Then there are these kind of problems. I'm just now getting used to the old style cruise control trying to run over the cars in front of me, now they want me to trust this? Boeing crashes?

Check out the number 3 on the sign (first link). A human would probably correctly read the sign, but the computer transposed the number.


https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/news...ph/ar-BB109xgU


https://www.newsweek.com/tesla-model...-signs-1487956


Kids will be kids.

[kazetsukai]

Originally Posted by kidharris

I think tech and the industrial complex is great and would not want to live without it. Without it, life would be much harder.

The problem isn't the technology. Its the fact that how it is implemented requires giving enormous powers to 3rd parties.

Originally Posted by kidharris

That said, there is just too many ways that it is being used by unscrupulous people, corporations, and governments for money, control, and power. You need to be vigilant or you become a contributor and/or a victim.

You cannot give the kind of surveillance powers we are talking about to any 3rd party and seriously expect them not to be abused in some way. The very idea is silly.

The solution isn't no-technology. The solution is technology that doesn't grant massive surveillance capabilities to 3rd parties. It is very possible to do this through cryptography in the cloud, or through advancements in computing power. It will come one way or another, when the current solutions fail to retain public trust. Failure which I guarantee you, will happen in very, very short order.

[Native]

As I look at the 35 MPH speed limit sign my head does see 85, then corrects to 35 ... and back and forth. I can understand how the optics of the cruise control could mis-read it. Interesting ...

[Getawaycarts]

what is it about roof top units that doesn't work well when traveling, but is ok when stationary?? Not being a smart A$$ just soaking up as much info as possible as I plan my build.

[Bon Voyage]

Originally Posted by Getawaycarts

what is it about roof top units that doesn't work well when traveling, but is ok when stationary?? Not being a smart A$$ just soaking up as much info as possible as I plan my build.

It’s powering them that is the problem while traveling; you can’t plug in while going down the highway. If you have a generator, lots of solar with lots of sun, or enough alternator power then you’re completely fine running the rooftop units while driving as long as you’ve hooked everything up right and safely.

Last summer I ran 1 of my RTU (rooftop unit) off my generator in my bus, the summer before I ran 2 RTU’s in my old motorhome off the generator. This summer I plan to try it off my alternator in the bus and see how it goes.