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Old 11-22-2020, 04:24 AM   #21
Bus Geek
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s2mikon View Post
Hi Rock-n-Ruth
I have had 2 propane catalytic heaters in 2 different rv's. I liked the radiant heat part of them very well. It warms your carcass not the air surrounding it. Both had the bad habit of wetting up the inside of the unit. In my argosy it was wet enough that you could wipe it off with a towel. They are not very tolerant of dust because it kills the catalyst. I lost the second one after I moved to NM. It is dusty here all the time. In this part of NM I can't even get a LPG bottle filled at night. That is why I went with the CDH and a wood stove for off grid. On grid I use a mini split and base board electric. Even here at midnight on Sunday I can get a 5 gal can of diesel filled. As for hard to install not really. If you can read chinglish and operate a drill with a hole saw it is very straight forward. You have to remember to not shut them down while running on low power. I likes to soot the units up. Before I shut them off I crank them up for 3-5 min and then power them off. I also run a gal of kerosene 1k after every 10-15 gallons of diesel. Just before it is empty I refill it with kerosene run it almost out and re fill with diesel. That is the nice thing about a school bus conversion. You get to do it like you want.
After I did my reply about how my 12kw coolant version doesn’t modulate much that instead cycles, I wrote the company VVKB to ask and their response was pretty much along your lines that the unit actually required less maintenance by having it run full blast then cycle out vs run at a slow speed for long periods of time. Even the glow pin was said to last longer as it doesn’t get sooted up.

MyVVKB wasn’t he cheapest but a lot less than the proheat or webasto or espar and yes parts are readily available.

To the rant crazy anti Chinese post , if the price between a Chinese device and the American or European equivalent wasnt 3X different then people might buy into the idea of staying away from the Chinese product. My VVKB heater lost prices at 1K, it can be found on sale for 700-800, the equivalent name brand is 3k -4K. Well for a poor sap like me. Of course said name brand gives its darling deals likely selling them at a 60% or more discount to the large volume buyers like bluebird or IC bus etc, the Chinese offer the darling deals to anyone ... if a real webasto or espar had been just a couple hundred more than my mid grade Chinese unit I would’ve bought it.

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Old 11-22-2020, 10:13 AM   #22
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I have both, the Wave 3 cat heater and the Chinese Diesel Heater. These are used seperately or together as needed in a dry camp situation as needed. Under way we use the original bus hot water system for interior heat.
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:14 PM   #23
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Hi cadillackid;
I just went to the VVKB web site and had a look around and it looks like they want to service what they sell. The air heaters look just like the same ones sold on ebay and amazon am I guessing right? I didn't see prices listed so I can't easily compare. Their installation documentation is far superior to what came with mine. This might be an option to buying on ebay or amazon. SUPPORT! It can make a difference. The coolant heaters look very interesting too. Are you using yours as hydronic heat or block heating? As to the price difference both espar and webasto were fined 68 million euros in 2015 by the EU for price fixing on contracts to OEM's. Later the US DOJ also fined both of them about 12 million each here in the US for doing the same thing. Hopefully this will convince them to price their product to market demands???
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Old 11-22-2020, 03:17 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by ChuckRatto View Post
I have both, the Wave 3 cat heater and the Chinese Diesel Heater. These are used seperately or together as needed in a dry camp situation as needed. Under way we use the original bus hot water system for interior heat.
When do you usually use each one? And I you could only have one which would it be?
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Old 11-22-2020, 04:37 PM   #25
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Dumb question maybe, are the kW and BTU specs people are stating the input or output?
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Old 11-22-2020, 05:59 PM   #26
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For propane fueled applications BTU is "Input". Usually KW refers to "Output".
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Old 11-22-2020, 06:55 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s2mikon View Post
Hi cadillackid;
I just went to the VVKB web site and had a look around and it looks like they want to service what they sell. The air heaters look just like the same ones sold on ebay and amazon am I guessing right? I didn't see prices listed so I can't easily compare. Their installation documentation is far superior to what came with mine. This might be an option to buying on ebay or amazon. SUPPORT! It can make a difference. The coolant heaters look very interesting too. Are you using yours as hydronic heat or block heating? As to the price difference both espar and webasto were fined 68 million euros in 2015 by the EU for price fixing on contracts to OEM's. Later the US DOJ also fined both of them about 12 million each here in the US for doing the same thing. Hopefully this will convince them to price their product to market demands???



so far support from VVKB has been great. the air heaters look similasr to the others ive sen around. im using the Appolo C3 coolant heater.. I boiught the 12 volt version. it came with everything needed to make it work including the digital control panel, antenna and wireless 2 way remote. I had questions , technical questions as i plan to make mine work independent of their controller, and they answered them, even sent me a wiring schematic of it.



I just have my antenna stuck on the wall inside the bus and it works good from inside my house (60 ft away or so)..



it seems like a quality piece of kit.. of course ill know more after I use the heck out of it in an ohio winter during covid.. it will get quite a few hours on it for sure.
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Old 11-22-2020, 08:33 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s2mikon View Post
I personally would like to see every last CCP Chinese made item gone, and no CCP Chinese made replacements. I am old enough to remember when we didn't have any of this stuff here. But we have to remember that it was our politicians of BOTH parties and corporate America that wanted to have “free trade” with China. This caused a lot of Americans to loose their good paying jobs and corporate America to reap huge profits having American brands built in China and sold at the same prices. Then the Chinese began to backdoor ripoff the same greedy corporate American businesses with knockoff copies and import them. It serves them right. I hope it breaks them like it did the poor American workforce that lost their jobs and homes and everything else. Delphi is a good example they file for bankruptcy layoff the help about 20,000 employees renege on their retirement to former employees and then move to China. You can go to O'Reilly auto parts and buy Delphi parts made in China. The same junk you can buy on ebay or amazon in Chinese boxes. At half the cost as far as I am concerned screw Delphi I'll buy the knockoff/ripoff first before I buy the Delphi. If I can even buy an American part I will. NAPA auto parts the same. NAPA= No American Parts Available. Timken wheel bearings? More junk. Yes it would be nice if I had to scour the internet look high and low to buy CCP Chinese crap, but I have to do that to find American made. It has to change. Sorry for the rant. I think I'll go drink my meds.
Empires rise and empires fall, empires come and empires go. Nothing lasts forever. The only constant is change: either embrace it, or be oppressed by it. Do people want to be like the dinosaurs or like the little furry proto-mammals 65 million years ago?

And regarding quality, perceived or otherwise, my experience is that crap can just as likely have a Made In USA label on it as a Made In Anywhere Else label. Yes, some American products are good, some not so good, and some are worthless crap, just like any other country's. I have two of the Chinese diesel heaters, and they are functionally identical to the overpriced Eberspaecher and Webasto heaters whose patents expired - almost $1000 for a Eberspaecher or less than $150 for a CDH is not a difficult decision. This is the reality of global free(ish) trade. One day the Chinese will be priced out of the market when someone else comes in cheaper, then the Chinese will be whining and complaining about unfair competition etc etc. The British went through all of this when their empire evaporated, and now Americans are experiencing the same.

John
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Old 12-15-2020, 03:58 PM   #29
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I went ahead and bought a chinese diesel heater, it got here a couple days ago and last night we used it for the first time. It was great, I got the 5kw one and it ran on low all night and kept the bus at 68 nicely. The quality is exactly I expected I guess I’ve bought enough harbor freight tools to know what you get. The install took me about 5 hours taking my time and I still need to plumb it into the buses tank. I’m super happy with it so far although I will do something to try and quite the pump ticking down a little bit. Thanks everyone for the recommendations to get it.
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Old 12-15-2020, 04:41 PM   #30
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The Wave 3 is just a "Chill Chaser". It doesn't heat up the entire bus when parked. I wouldn't want it on while bouncing down the road, for safety reasons. The Diesel Heater is sometimes used to augment the original bus hot water heaters when driving. When pa r ked, Dry Camp, the Diesel Heater is used quite often. If we are in Full Hookup, we try to use a portable electric heater as much as possible, the Diesel heater occasionally.
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Old 12-15-2020, 06:51 PM   #31
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you can isolate those pumps further with a double rubber mount if the clicking is an issue, the real webasto came with such a mount, my chinese one didnt.. hence i can hear the clicker more on the chinese one but since I use blowers with mine I mostly just hear the blowers moving the heat from the coils than I do the clicker
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Old 12-16-2020, 08:13 PM   #32
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I used the fuel pump mounts from an early volvo 240 series car. They have 6mm studs on both ends and are about 25mm high. Now I have to go outside to hear the pumps click. I bought them on ebay. VW, Saab, Audi, Jaguar and MBZ all used them. The Chinaspacher pump mount slides over one of the studs and the other stud is mounted to the bus. That makes it double insulated. It got down to 19 degrees here early this morning and both of them have no problems keeping it nice and toasty.
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Old 12-16-2020, 08:23 PM   #33
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thats a cool idea for the pump mounts!!
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Old 12-16-2020, 09:49 PM   #34
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Thanks for the tip! I’m going to try and track one down
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Old 12-16-2020, 09:57 PM   #35
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Just as a point of reference the very early volvo pump mount, these were the 140 series cars, was 1/4-20 thread and I don't remember if the chinaspacher heater mount hole will fit a 1/4” bolt. I just happened to have 2 of the early 240 series volvo pump mounts that were 6mm and used them. These are good for a lot of other chores in mounting things that need noise and vibration isolation.
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:13 PM   #36
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I was looking on rock auto and a quick google search but didn’t find them, where do you buy them? They do look like good isolation mounts for random things
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:31 PM   #37
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Here some on ebay. https://www.ebay.com/itm/VOLVO-FUEL-...8AAMXQkl9Rc~ZZ
I think he is asking to much but now you know what to look for.
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:34 PM   #38
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Dorman part # 911-926 will not work.
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:37 PM   #39
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You have to watch the ebay sellers. Sometimes they over price their goods.
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Old 12-16-2020, 10:38 PM   #40
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What part of central Ca are you in?
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