RV News RVBusiness 2021 Top 10 RVs of the Year, plus 56 additional debuts and must-see units → ×


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 10-22-2020, 05:10 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Somewhere in the US
Posts: 60
Year: 2004
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: Cummins 5.9
Rated Cap: 42
Fuel source for diesel heater

Hi guys

I'm just about to finish the installation of our diesel heater and I need a verification on tapping on to the engine supply line. In addition to all the electrical connections, there seem to be two fuel connections on the top of the fuel tank. One is a flexible 3/8" id line and the other is a smaller (1/4"?) metal line that connects immediately to a square-shaped device before connecting to a small flexible hose.

I'm attaching a photo so you can see what I'm talking about.

My assumption has been that the larger hose is the feed and the smaller one is the return. Can anyone verify that for me?

BTW, it's on a 2004 Blue Bird TC2000 with the 5.9 Cummins.

Thanks
Attached Images
File Type: jpg IMG_20201021_161349490.jpg (189.0 KB, 31 views)
ghodges is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-22-2020, 09:00 PM   #2
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 14,144
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
DONT tap into the existing fuel lines for your heater... the heater will either suck the prime dry out of your supply line for the engine.. or your engine will suck the prime dry from the heater / suck air..



if your tank doesnt have an available fitting, then drill a hole in the tank and use the quick fitting that the heater kit comes with and stab a new pickup down.. be sure to be careful when choosing a spot for the new hole that it doesnt interfere with the fuel gauge float or other pickups..



a suggestion is to have the heater fuel pickup a couple inches above the engine pickup.. so a heater left on accidentilly will not run your bus so far out of fuel that it cant be driven to a station.. .



when I drilled the hole in mine i used a stepper bit that pulls all of its shavings outware and I had a shop VAC sucking the whole time around the hole so I didnt put debris down in my tank..
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 09:57 AM   #3
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Somewhere in the US
Posts: 60
Year: 2004
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: Cummins 5.9
Rated Cap: 42
Thanks cadillackid. I appreciate your advice as usual. I'll definitely take your suggestions into consideration.
ghodges is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 10:55 AM   #4
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: West Ohio
Posts: 1,968
Year: 1984
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: International 1753
Engine: 6.9 International
Rated Cap: 65
Definitely have a dedicated pickup for your heater.

I don't have one for my generator. So I had to put check valves in the fuel line so as to not suck the other's fuel system dry. I have to be careful so as not to run the tank empty, or I'll be screwed. That's something I just keep in mind, and I don't worry about it, as I know how to bleed my fuel system if the inevitable does happen. And it will happen eventually.
__________________
The Silver Bullet https://www.skoolie.net/forums/f11/p...llet-9266.html
Booyah45828 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 11:06 AM   #5
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Wake Forest NC
Posts: 342
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Vista 3600
Engine: T444E
Rated Cap: 24000 lbs
I used the 10L tank came with our diesel heater.. mounted it on the back wall in the garage, behind the outboard motor for the boat.

It lasts surprisingly long on 10l and I didn't want to tap our main tank.

I figure if I run low on diesel in a pinch I have 10 litres I can suck out and maybe make it to a filling station

likewise if I am parked and need to refill the heater tank and don't want to go get more I can easily suck some out of the bus and fill the heater

just how we do it
RolesvilleMarina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 11:36 AM   #6
Bus Crazy
 
Drew Bru's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: Minnehaha Co., SD
Posts: 1,158
Year: 1996
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: International
Engine: DT466
Rated Cap: 65
Quote:
Originally Posted by RolesvilleMarina View Post
I used the 10L tank came with our diesel heater.. mounted it on the back wall in the garage, behind the outboard motor for the boat.

It lasts surprisingly long on 10l and I didn't want to tap our main tank.

I figure if I run low on diesel in a pinch I have 10 litres I can suck out and maybe make it to a filling station

likewise if I am parked and need to refill the heater tank and don't want to go get more I can easily suck some out of the bus and fill the heater

just how we do it
Yeah, we do it the same way. That 10 liters lasts a few/several nights and we've got a 5 gal. diesel jug to top it off when necessary, then refill when we get into town.
__________________
Our Build: https://dazzlingbluebus.wordpress.com/
Drew Bru is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-23-2020, 03:36 PM   #7
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 14,144
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
That’s neat having a separate tank!! Neither of my heaters came with a tank. Love that idea esp if you fill it every time you fill the bus you are right, always have a couple gallons of reserve
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2020, 08:07 AM   #8
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Wake Forest NC
Posts: 342
Year: 1998
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Vista 3600
Engine: T444E
Rated Cap: 24000 lbs
Odd... the kits come with the plastic flat 10l tank usually

I did find them for sale on amazon for about $30 though

I need to figure out how to host pics again on this site

then I can show ours
RolesvilleMarina is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2020, 08:34 AM   #9
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 14,144
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
both of my heaters are coolant units so it may be that they didnt come with.. one is a real webasto i got back in 2016 from a store lqiuidating. and the other is a 12kw chinese unit i got this year..



it could be only opne or two companies actually manufacture the air heaters and include a tank so most all the sellers show up with them.



I thought about an air heater in my DEV bus but seeing as how it lacks glowplugs and really would have a bad time starting if its below 0f so I wanted a way to warm up the engine and the heater loops both.. my red bus has glowplugs and ive started it at -10f with pretty much ease.. when I travel I cant always count on being able to plug in the block heater so having an alternative source to pre-warm the engine is a must.. while I generally like to be in places where id be on the A/C, it seems like at least once i end up someplace pretty far north in the dead of winter.. at -10f i'd never be able to fire that DT360 and I wont use ether unless it was a life / death scenerio..



for a 12kw heater though 10 liters isnt going to last very long.. on ful blast it uses up to 3 liters per hour .. grsanted it doesnt necessarilt run on high all the time. but i have tested with the windows down (for testing) in 40 degree weather and I can turn on enough fans inside to keep the heater on full blast.. I was attemptingto simulate what it might be like parked in 0f weather .. so I cracked open windows for heat loss..



Fuel capacity in both of my main drivers is an issue being shorties I have either 30 or 35 gallon tanks.. I havent measured the dimensions and navistar when i called them said it shows 2 different tanks for my VINs.. a 30 and a 35.. in other words on trips I stop for fuel a lot.. add the diesel heaters and I get fuel more..


add winter means i never want to be below 1/2 tank means I get fuel a really lot..



I dont have a really good place to add a second fuel tank on the shorties.. at least not for driving.. im not too keen on putting a fuel tank behind the axle. a rear end collision with a car almosrt always ends up in the car going under the bus.. while diesel fuel isnt near as flammable as gasoline.. it can and will burn..



-Christopher
cadillackid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2020, 11:45 AM   #10
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Somewhere in the US
Posts: 60
Year: 2004
Coachwork: Blue Bird
Chassis: TC2000
Engine: Cummins 5.9
Rated Cap: 42
Our unit did come with the 10l tank but since we already have a jerry can mounted on the back with gasoline for our generator (also mounted on the back), I didn't want to have to find a way to carry another can with diesel. I did briefly consider trying to mount the heater fuel tank next to our main tank so I could siphon fuel into the heater tank, but that would be a pain and I'd have to then store a stinky siphon hose.

Now if I traded in my genny for a diesel one... Hmm...
ghodges is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2020, 07:09 PM   #11
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,935
tapping into your main fuel tank really is not that hard nor expensive
john61ct is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2020, 09:40 PM   #12
Bus Nut
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Orange County, CA
Posts: 970
Year: 1990
Coachwork: integral
Chassis: Crown Supercoach II (rear engine)
Engine: Detroit 6V92TAC, DDEC 2, Jake brake, Allison HT740
Rated Cap: 37,400 lbs GVWR
See if your bus's tank has a spare port on the top that you can use for the heater's supply; mine had an unused 1/2" port, so I soldered a stainless 3/8" tube to a 1/2" brass reducer to give me a feed from it for my two Chinese diesel air heaters. From the bus's tank a 3/8" hose goes to two Amarine gear pumps, one for each heater, that push fuel to the heaters' 10-liter day tanks. This way the heaters' own clicky pumps don't have to pull fuel half a mile from the bus's tank, and the heaters' own pumps are below their day tanks so they always have a gravity feed. Easy! And yes, the heaters' pickup tube in the bus's tank is 4" shorter than the engine's pickup tube.

John
Iceni John is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-28-2020, 04:27 PM   #13
Almost There
 
Join Date: Sep 2017
Location: Cerrillos, NM
Posts: 88
Year: 2002
Coachwork: Amtran
Chassis: Front Engine
Engine: DT466E
Rated Cap: 72
Iíll confirm the advice here from the other side...
I teeíd off the main fuel line and it sucks the fuel lines dry from the heater when I run the bus so itís a nightmare. Was fine when I was stationary but not so much anymore. Lesson learned.
rffffffff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 12:20 AM   #14
New Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 7
We ran our new 5k chinese diesel air heater all night and burned about 5l. Pretty impressive how little it uses.
Having an air tight space will be a huge heat saver compared to having a window open. But it was only 30 degrees. Not zero.
It came with a 10l wall mount container off Amazon. We be bring a 6 gallon can with to fill up at the station since our shortie is gas.
TravisJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 03:26 AM   #15
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: Nov 2016
Posts: 1,935
There are gas-fueled equivalents.

Been looking for hydronic-only gas-fueled ones. . .
john61ct is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 04:38 AM   #16
Almost There
 
flattracker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Bly Oregon
Posts: 86
Year: 1986
Coachwork: Crown
Chassis: Supercoach
Engine: Cummins 350 big cam
Rated Cap: 86 passengers?
A thought about using the fuel source for the engine for running a diesel fired heater. When I installed a diesel generator (Onan 6.5 kw) in my bus, I also installed a 20 gallon fuel tank for the generator. When I had the engine replaced I had a T fitting installed and capped at the output of the fuel filter for use to fill the generator tank from the main tank as backup. The fuel transfer system uses a solenoid valve and an electric fuel pump in the design. The transfer system will monitor fuel levels in both tanks to prevent overfill of the generator tank, and complete draining of the main fuel tank. I believe that the net result of running the transfer system with the bus running will be a little extra fuel flow through the filter. The fuel pump has a built in check valve so that the engine cannot pull fuel from the generator tank. The generator tank also has a filler accessible from the generator compartment, allowing it to be filled separately. The idea is that I could initiate fuel transfer about 15 minutes before a fuel stop and then only need to fill the main tank at a truck stop or gas station. The transfer system does not move fuel at a high rate.
flattracker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 06:11 AM   #17
New Member
 
Join Date: May 2020
Posts: 7
Quote:
Originally Posted by flattracker View Post
A thought about using the fuel source for the engine for running a diesel fired heater. When I installed a diesel generator (Onan 6.5 kw) in my bus, I also installed a 20 gallon fuel tank for the generator. When I had the engine replaced I had a T fitting installed and capped at the output of the fuel filter for use to fill the generator tank from the main tank as backup. The fuel transfer system uses a solenoid valve and an electric fuel pump in the design. The transfer system will monitor fuel levels in both tanks to prevent overfill of the generator tank, and complete draining of the main fuel tank. I believe that the net result of running the transfer system with the bus running will be a little extra fuel flow through the filter. The fuel pump has a built in check valve so that the engine cannot pull fuel from the generator tank. The generator tank also has a filler accessible from the generator compartment, allowing it to be filled separately. The idea is that I could initiate fuel transfer about 15 minutes before a fuel stop and then only need to fill the main tank at a truck stop or gas station. The transfer system does not move fuel at a high rate.
Interesting. I didnt realize that.
TravisJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 09:07 AM   #18
Bus Crazy
 
WIbluebird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Wisconsin
Posts: 1,070
Year: 2001
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: All American
Engine: 8.3 Cummins ISC
Rated Cap: 75
The top of my tank has 2 1" diameter brass plugs in it. I successfully got one off however I am haveing a hell of a time getting the supplied fuel pickup tube from my 5kw chinese diesel heater to fit in there.

Does anyone have any recommendations for a 1" fitting that could screw into the existing tank tap? I think it makes little to no sense to be drilling new holes when I can use one of the factory openings.
WIbluebird is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2020, 10:02 AM   #19
Bus Crazy
 
Join Date: May 2014
Location: West Ohio
Posts: 1,968
Year: 1984
Coachwork: Bluebird
Chassis: International 1753
Engine: 6.9 International
Rated Cap: 65
What threads are you working with? If the heater pickup and the tank plug are both pipe threads you should be able to find an adapter to make it work. I know my local napa has them in a cabinet, yours might too.
__________________
The Silver Bullet https://www.skoolie.net/forums/f11/p...llet-9266.html
Booyah45828 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2020, 02:20 AM   #20
Almost There
 
flattracker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Bly Oregon
Posts: 86
Year: 1986
Coachwork: Crown
Chassis: Supercoach
Engine: Cummins 350 big cam
Rated Cap: 86 passengers?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cadillackid View Post
both of my heaters are coolant units so it may be that they didnt come with.. one is a real webasto i got back in 2016 from a store lqiuidating. and the other is a 12kw chinese unit i got this year..



it could be only opne or two companies actually manufacture the air heaters and include a tank so most all the sellers show up with them.



I thought about an air heater in my DEV bus but seeing as how it lacks glowplugs and really would have a bad time starting if its below 0f so I wanted a way to warm up the engine and the heater loops both.. my red bus has glowplugs and ive started it at -10f with pretty much ease.. when I travel I cant always count on being able to plug in the block heater so having an alternative source to pre-warm the engine is a must.. while I generally like to be in places where id be on the A/C, it seems like at least once i end up someplace pretty far north in the dead of winter.. at -10f i'd never be able to fire that DT360 and I wont use ether unless it was a life / death scenerio..



for a 12kw heater though 10 liters isnt going to last very long.. on ful blast it uses up to 3 liters per hour .. grsanted it doesnt necessarilt run on high all the time. but i have tested with the windows down (for testing) in 40 degree weather and I can turn on enough fans inside to keep the heater on full blast.. I was attemptingto simulate what it might be like parked in 0f weather .. so I cracked open windows for heat loss..



Fuel capacity in both of my main drivers is an issue being shorties I have either 30 or 35 gallon tanks.. I havent measured the dimensions and navistar when i called them said it shows 2 different tanks for my VINs.. a 30 and a 35.. in other words on trips I stop for fuel a lot.. add the diesel heaters and I get fuel more..


add winter means i never want to be below 1/2 tank means I get fuel a really lot..



I dont have a really good place to add a second fuel tank on the shorties.. at least not for driving.. im not too keen on putting a fuel tank behind the axle. a rear end collision with a car almosrt always ends up in the car going under the bus.. while diesel fuel isnt near as flammable as gasoline.. it can and will burn..



-Christopher

The mid engine Crown buses have the fuel tank behind the rear axle(s) and a trunk behind the fuel tank. I think if you have a few feet or more between the rear bumper and a fuel tank, you would be OK, especially if the tank is mounted high under the floor.
flattracker is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Featured Campgrounds

Reviews provided by

Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v3.2.3

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:54 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
×