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Old 04-06-2022, 05:14 PM   #1
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jan 2021
Location: Louisville, KY
Posts: 68
Year: 2006
Coachwork: Thomas
Chassis: Front Engine
Engine: Cat C7
Rated Cap: 84
Data analytics on ECM data?

Anyone know how to stream data from a 2004 CAT C7?

Yes, I know I could get CAT ET on my laptop, but that's not what I'm after.

I'd like to get a data stream from the ECM on my bus so that I can have both live and trended views of engine data in real time.

The little bit I've seen on CAT ET is unimpressive. It's build for techs to troubleshoot/tune an engine. I want to get at the raw data stream so that I can use it to build a glass cockpit for my bus, and have full dataset from my engine to review trends in metrics so that I can stay ahead of things on PM.

I'm a business intelligence consultant by trade. I spend my working hours structuring all types of raw data for analysis and building analytical tools to help folks make better decisions based on said data. This seems like it would be both extremely useful, and lots of fun.
  1. Anyone ever tried this before?
  2. Anyone have insight on whether it is possible to get raw data from a CAT ECM w/o ET?
  3. Does CAT have their ECM data so locked down with their proprietary software that this is impossible?
  4. Any other reasons why this may be a dumb idea?

I'd love to hear your thoughts

tomrasdf is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-31-2022, 11:16 AM   #2
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Anywhere we can park (currently PA)
Posts: 136
Year: 2004
Coachwork: International
Chassis: RE300
Engine: DT466E
Rated Cap: 76
Iíve been working on something like this as well. There are a few options:

1) the BlueFire device does have an API, but only for Android I believe, so it probably wouldnít fit exactly what you are looking for as is. However, you could probably read the data stream since itís probably just a Bluetooth COM port. There are libraries for python to enable reading of NMEA and various engine data strings (J1939, etc).

2) any other data reading device for your engine that connects to a computer. Basically, same as the BlueFire above, but different manufacturer. A couple I can think of are the cheap Chinese knock-off diagnostic tools and a (much) better quality version from Power Hungry Performance. I have not tried any of them in this specific use case, but I donít see why it wouldnít work.

3) if you have a raspberry pi SBC version 3B+ or higher, there is a data hat specifically designed for reading engine data. I have one and it does work. There are a few YouTube videos I think of a British gent using it to monitor his car.

#3 would be my choice because you have the ability to add displays and you have built in support for various programming languages and I/O for additional sensors out of the box.

My hope is to get a full color eInk screen to replace my gauge cluster. Let me know if you want to discuss in more depthÖthis is a project Iíd love to dust off. Plus, itís always more fun with someone else.

Anyway, hope this helps!
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Old 08-31-2022, 11:32 AM   #3
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Anywhere we can park (currently PA)
Posts: 136
Year: 2004
Coachwork: International
Chassis: RE300
Engine: DT466E
Rated Cap: 76
Quote:
Originally Posted by tomrasdf View Post
[LIST=1][*]Does CAT have their ECM data so locked down with their proprietary software that this is impossible?[/LIST
Forgot to address this. There may be a few CAT specific details that are proprietary, but Iíd be surprised if most data wasnít sent via standard J1939/J1708. Note that your engine may have both types of data streaming as well. My IHC is that way.

Anyway, wanted to make sure I hit all of your points!

Jeremy
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Old 09-07-2022, 09:58 AM   #4
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Aug 2022
Location: Eaton Rapids
Posts: 20
Year: 2004
Coachwork: Eldorado
Chassis: E450
Engine: 6.0 Powerstroke
Rated Cap: 14+2
if you do analytics that aren't real time - use a logger and post process:

Pick me! Pick me!

that is just a random one i haven't personally used, but, given the specs and data info they included, they appear to know what they are about. seems like 32gb could likely hold weeks worth of data given what i am assuming is a very small payload per packet. not the same field, but, when i monitor electrical or HVAC data a 4gb monitor doing 1 second intervals by 4 channels will last like, 130 some days.

you could probably set your phone up as a web host and hot spot it to have the api post - even if you did it like, daily, it'd be a pretty small file.

then you can do all of the fun data stuff you want how you want. probably even line up trouble codes with data values and things like that.

just my 2 cents.
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Old 04-25-2024, 06:26 PM   #5
Mini-Skoolie
 
Join Date: Jun 2023
Posts: 26
Year: 2001
Chassis: 2001 International 3800
Engine: DT466E
Rated Cap: 26000
@ jjaj823

Do you have any links to the RPI hat? I have been pondering how I could integrate my bluefire into my home assistant setup, would be neat to have a dash view that I could control other elements of the build from the cockpit all on the same device if needed.
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Old 04-25-2024, 06:49 PM   #6
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Anywhere we can park (currently PA)
Posts: 136
Year: 2004
Coachwork: International
Chassis: RE300
Engine: DT466E
Rated Cap: 76
This is the one I have:

https://copperhilltech.com/pican-2-can-bus-interface-for-raspberry-pi/

Iíve been working on something similar. I am working up a replacement for my big switch cluster for all the bus gizmosÖrunning lights, headlights, etc.

Iíve got an ESP32 microcontroller with a set of relays connected to a 3.5Ē touch screen. I used a set of graphics from an open-source stream deck as a template for the buttons. Next on the list is a 3D printed case.

Additionally, Iím working on a system to control bus functions like turning on the AC if Iím not around and the temp gets to high, turning off non-critical functions if battery gets too low etc.

The issue Iím having with the glass dash is making sure whatever I replace the gauges withÖwell, works. Iíve had reliability issues with the BlueFire and also, I canít find a display I like that doesnít flare in the sun.

Hope this helps!

JB
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Old 04-25-2024, 07:29 PM   #7
Bus Geek
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Columbus Ohio
Posts: 18,914
Year: 1991
Coachwork: Carpenter
Chassis: International 3800
Engine: DTA360 / MT643
Rated Cap: 7 Row Handicap
Quote:
Originally Posted by jjaj823 View Post
This is the one I have:

https://copperhilltech.com/pican-2-c...-raspberry-pi/

Iíve been working on something similar. I am working up a replacement for my big switch cluster for all the bus gizmosÖrunning lights, headlights, etc.

Iíve got an ESP32 microcontroller with a set of relays connected to a 3.5Ē touch screen. I used a set of graphics from an open-source stream deck as a template for the buttons. Next on the list is a 3D printed case.

Additionally, Iím working on a system to control bus functions like turning on the AC if Iím not around and the temp gets to high, turning off non-critical functions if battery gets too low etc.

The issue Iím having with the glass dash is making sure whatever I replace the gauges withÖwell, works. Iíve had reliability issues with the BlueFire and also, I canít find a display I like that doesnít flare in the sun.

Hope this helps!

JB

I love copperhill stuff.. i have a couple of the USB to J1939 boards and they work great... they can be masters or slaves..



im also working on a glass dash.. of course raspberry Pi.. and with mine im using a USB relay controller.. the Rpi5 unfortunately still doesnt have true power control.. however i can read GPIO to power it off.. and once powered off a delay box cuts off its actual power.. my methodology is a timed system... after ignition off I can be screens off yet processor on for X amount of time.. say 2 hours, 3 hours whatever I feel.. if I go back t oKey on in that time, my pi is still fully booted and running and the screens come on... if I go longer than X time, then my power off sequence executes which involves shutting down the pi and then the delay box goes into off-delay.. so a minute later it pwoers off the pi.. this alloows for clean shutdowns and no parasitic battery drain.. at key on it boots the whole thing back up.. boot time after full shutdown is a little longer.. but so is my idle up time as i wait for the bus to warm up, fill its air suspension, and the like..



J1939 doesnt provide everything I need.. on navistar the J1939 link is only for transmission tio engine link so it really doesnt work well for diagnostics.. J1708 is where i can issue a special sequence of J1708 requests which brings on the Navistar specific PID's... I use my Advantech box for the J1708.. I was using the serial version, but got the later USB version and it works great on a Pi..



ive been through the ringer on various ideas for the GUI.. and have come down to using a websockets setup for the switches.. its all local and so no worries about security.. there is internet connectivity in that bus however it sits behind a firewall on the cellular link and the pi is not even accessible remotely other than through my IPSEC tunnel.. websockets allows me big versatility in how the front end looks and ease of how the backend functions using SQLITE and PHP to make things work..



originally my plan was to use QT for the GUI but i really didnt like the much slower boot times of booting a full GUI OS on the pi and getting into QT.. backend processing was much harder too..



ive already experimented alot with the digital dash concept in the RedByrd using a mix of various softwares and hardwares.. and what I have works.. and was good for 2017 when i built the setup.. but time to move on...



also time to gear down from 3.54 to 4.10, swap my turbo and really let the bird "fly"... while i dont drive fast, the idea of a school bus that can squeal the tires is intruiging
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Old 04-25-2024, 09:30 PM   #8
Skoolie
 
Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Anywhere we can park (currently PA)
Posts: 136
Year: 2004
Coachwork: International
Chassis: RE300
Engine: DT466E
Rated Cap: 76
Cadillac -

I studied your setup before starting mine. For the GUI, I was thinking about just serving up a local webpage. Like you, most of my data comes via J1708. Iím also considering feeding that data into NMEA0183 sentencesÖthen I can use a modified version of OpenCPNÖon boats, that monitors engine data, navigation, and other systems. Havenít tried it yet, but hoping soon.

With the advances in AI, it would be super cool to have something like voice controlled cruise control, the ability to have automatic response to trouble codes, etc.

I have a rack full of pi CM4 modules and some regular pi 4Bs that are begging for some attention. Now if I could just find more hours in a day!

JB
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