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Old 11-27-2023, 11:14 AM   #1
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Smoking improperly caged wheels

I tried to move my bus after about 3 months of parking and I couldn't release the parking brakes. I was a newbie then and did not know about caging the rear brakes. I called a mechanic that I thought was familiar with air brakes but he wasn't. He had to call someone that knew. In short, I was able to drive it and I thought this guy was going to follow me. He didn't. after about eight miles, I started to lose power and pulled over to find one of my rear brakes was smoking and sizzling. I then looked at a YouTube vid on how to properly cage brakes and was able to get it to NationWide Truck Repair (avoid these guys). Told the person at the desk to see if there was permanent damage but you never know how precise the mechanics are at this place and if he was given the correct questions. Anyway, the desk clerk told me it was fine after charging me several hundred dollars.

When I got it back, I took a look and noticed that one side brake did have a lot more wear so I'll have to replace it the brakes sooner than normal.

My question is what other areas should I check or do maintenance to just incase. There was that sizzling which I believe was the bearing grease and hopefully not the rear end oil. What do you suggest. Repack the bearings, drain and replace the rearend oil, etc?

Any costs related, I will be taking the first mechanic to court to compensate me for those expenses.

Oh I remembered the first mechanic disconnected a wire I believe it was connected to a solenoid that was behind the battery compartment. Not sure what it does.



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Old 11-27-2023, 02:38 PM   #2
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... duplicate
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Old 11-27-2023, 02:41 PM   #3
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Assume for a minute it was properly caged......Always the possibility the service side of the brakes were also corroded and causing the stick/release issue from pedal application. Hence, the onset of drag came once you were using service brakes.

Drums/rotors get blued and denatured sometimes from those nuclear events. That's visible. I'd do the things you listed, except I'd smell/inspect the diff oil and make an educated decision. I'd likely do a clean, inspect and lube of moving brake components. Replace linings if they smell like fiery death.
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Old 11-27-2023, 03:10 PM   #4
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Hold up.

You drove the bus down the road with caged brakes? Yeah that's a no-no.......

And people wonder why skoolie insurance is impossible to get........

As far as suing is concerned, I wouldn't waste your time, you've got no case. First mechanic isn't liable for you driving illegally on caged brakes. Vehicles with caged brakes are only to be towed, as the tow vehicles brakes would then be in use. You clearly aren't familiar with air brake operation, as caging the brakes doesn't eliminate them from being operated by the service brake, which you very likely did by driving the damn thing.

Please just stop what you're doing before you get someone killed.
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Old 11-27-2023, 03:21 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Roadtube Vagrant View Post
Assume for a minute it was properly caged......Always the possibility the service side of the brakes were also corroded and causing the stick/release issue from pedal application. Hence, the onset of drag came once you were using service brakes.

Drums/rotors get blued and denatured sometimes from those nuclear events. That's visible. I'd do the things you listed, except I'd smell/inspect the diff oil and make an educated decision. I'd likely do a clean, inspect and lube of moving brake components. Replace linings if they smell like fiery death.
No it wasn’t and I was able to cage it. It had lots of room on that side for the bolt to turn. Thanks for suggesting what to do next.
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Old 11-27-2023, 03:24 PM   #6
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So you mean the mechanic who told me to drive it cage gave me the wrong advice. That is illegal to do so. Sounds like I do have a case, including liability.

The front brakes worked fine.

Thank you for the information
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Old 11-27-2023, 03:43 PM   #7
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Generally, caging is to get you off the road to a safe location or for front-lift towing, no extended driving. If I was the service writer, I'd have had you sign a work order stating emergency situation requiring temp disabling of emergency brake system.
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Old 11-27-2023, 11:02 PM   #8
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Given the litigious tendency displayed, I'm going to pass on offering any suggestions about what to do with that rear wheel/bearing/hub issue beyond having it inspected by a qualified shop. And I sure hope it wasn't my caging video you watched...now I've got to go back and make sure I adequately cautioned that caging wasn't to be done before driving a vehicle on the road.

For others reading this thread, I'll add onto the comments others have made about the danger of what was done. Caging the brakes pulls back the spring brake portion of the rear brake canisters/chambers...which is the parking brake portion of the air brakes. When you pull the (usually) yellow button, you release the air pressure that's counteracting the spring pressure and when that air pressure is released the big-ass spring presses on the arm (a slack adjuster) and rotates an S cam, which spreads the brake shoes...applying braking force to the rear wheels. But...and here's the real danger...that function isn't solely for parking. It's also an important safety feature, so that if you lose air pressure in your brake system the spring brakes are automatically applied. If you cage the rear spring brakes and then drive...and lose air pressure...you have NO brakes at all.
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Old 11-28-2023, 12:08 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by rossvtaylor View Post
Given the litigious tendency displayed, I'm going to pass on offering any suggestions about what to do with that rear wheel/bearing/hub issue beyond having it inspected by a qualified shop. And I sure hope it wasn't my caging video you watched...now I've got to go back and make sure I adequately cautioned that caging wasn't to be done before driving a vehicle on the road.

For others reading this thread, I'll add onto the comments others have made about the danger of what was done. Caging the brakes pulls back the spring brake portion of the rear brake canisters/chambers...which is the parking brake portion of the air brakes. When you pull the (usually) yellow button, you release the air pressure that's counteracting the spring pressure and when that air pressure is released the big-ass spring presses on the arm (a slack adjuster) and rotates an S cam, which spreads the brake shoes...applying braking force to the rear wheels. But...and here's the real danger...that function isn't solely for parking. It's also an important safety feature, so that if you lose air pressure in your brake system the spring brakes are automatically applied. If you cage the rear spring brakes and then drive...and lose air pressure...you have NO brakes at all.
Very true at that. And I wouldn't worry about litigation towards you or any videos you make. You can always claim you are just an unqualified user posting videos on youtube. But for future videos I would ensure you mention at the beginning that you aren't a mechanic or anything, just offering learned advice.
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Old 11-28-2023, 08:10 AM   #10
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I have my ideas about how to fix it and what you need to do going forward but sue happy people scare the F out of me..


and you made enough mistakes in this that you likely dont have a case.. at least not anything that will net you any resolve...



at this point id say do a couple things..


1. send the bus to a reputable repair shop and have the whole front and rear brake and driveline system gone over.


2. while said bus is in the shop, go find your local truck driver training school and inquire if they have a class for large RV owners on care / maintenance and take the class... the right clkass will give you the full CDL style run-down on air brakes..


both of these things will cost money.. if you are too cheap or broke then sell the bus and realize commercial vehicles may not be for you..


-Christopher
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Old 11-28-2023, 01:14 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannabus View Post
I tried to move my bus after about 3 months of parking and I couldn't release the parking brakes. I was a newbie then and did not know about caging the rear brakes. I called a mechanic that I thought was familiar with air brakes but he wasn't. He had to call someone that knew. In short, I was able to drive it and I thought this guy was going to follow me. He didn't. after about eight miles, I started to lose power and pulled over to find one of my rear brakes was smoking and sizzling. I then looked at a YouTube vid on how to properly cage brakes and was able to get it to NationWide Truck Repair (avoid these guys). Told the person at the desk to see if there was permanent damage but you never know how precise the mechanics are at this place and if he was given the correct questions. Anyway, the desk clerk told me it was fine after charging me several hundred dollars.

When I got it back, I took a look and noticed that one side brake did have a lot more wear so I'll have to replace it the brakes sooner than normal.

My question is what other areas should I check or do maintenance to just incase. There was that sizzling which I believe was the bearing grease and hopefully not the rear end oil. What do you suggest. Repack the bearings, drain and replace the rearend oil, etc?

Any costs related, I will be taking the first mechanic to court to compensate me for those expenses.

Oh I remembered the first mechanic disconnected a wire I believe it was connected to a solenoid that was behind the battery compartment. Not sure what it does.


This is really sad, not wishing to attack a new (or any) member but talking about suing, right out of the gate, when you yourself haven't done you basic homework with regards to "Skoolie" life, the journey involved.


Let's take a look at this...

You called a mechanic you "thought" had knowledge of air brakes.
Did you ask him straight out, "hey, do you know about air brake systems"?
Did you ask hime if he had any training certifications lake maybe and ASE ?

Did he provide you with a service invoice for "professional" mechanical services or advice...or was it a cash deal?

Did he tell you, specifically say" that it was ok to drive on caged brakes?

Please take all these comments with a grain of salt, if you sue him, hire and pay for an attorney, he might just also hire an attorney who will ask you these questions too, and many more, much more offensive questions that might not make you look good at all...and then there is the "spending 5 grand to defend $500.

If you win, best you will get is a judgment and let me tell you, judgements are not much better than toilet paper! If he has no assets, what are you gonna get? You still gotta pay your lawyer!
He can turn around and pay you $10 a week, for a long time!

Then there is the after thought, who here would want to help you? If their answer is wrong, not complete or you do it wrong....are you gonna sue?

I mean all of this in a friendly way, skoolie life is a journey of learning, sharing and hopefully making new friends.

It doesn't sound like your first mechanic did something wrong, from what I read on your post. He just gave you his best un-educated thoughts.

In the skoolie journey, you too are gonna make some mistakes, some small some expensive!

So I ask you to let it go as a good learning experience.



As to the questions you ask about the seals/grease and oil.

As a new and RESPONSIBLE skooolie builder, I would go ahead and replace the diff oil, but only from a maintenance perspective. I would also build/create a maintenance log an start documenting the maintenance items you perform and or inspect.

Take the wheels of, yes I know if a big job, but who better to inspect what is going on inside the wheels/drums.
Axle seals are real easy to replace and it is surely a great feeling driving down the road knowing these to simple to do items have been checked off the list.

Don't be scared, brake lining are also real easy to do on a bus. I replaced my brake pads, wheel/axle seals and brake drums too on my bus, not hard, just a dirty job!

I easily saved 2-3 grand by doing it myself.

Sure you could pay hundreds to a mechanic, whom you may or may not trust, but believe me when I say this, doing it yourself, you WILL get it done right, you WILL know what you got in terms of good vs worn parts and you WILL not only learn how to fix/repair/maintain you bus but you will also get it done very economically as compared to a diesel shop hourly rate of $150-200 bucks and hour!

Again, I am not attacking you or your thoughts, just sharing mine!

BTW,

DISCLAIMER:

I am not a professional, student, amateur, backyard, shade tree, wannabe mechanic, Electrician, lawyer, financial adviser, engineer, designer, or palm reader.
I am just a regular guy who has graduated from the school of hard knocks who is currently working on his triple masters degree over at YouTube university majoring in mastery of disastery!

Any advice I give is not to be believed, but instead, seriously questioned and ultimately classified as a pure guess, not to be relied on in life or in court!

Ok, now you can sue me too!

ROFLMAO.....

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Old 11-28-2023, 02:27 PM   #12
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lol, we'll all be in a lawsuit by the time this saga finishes. I wonder if rvlife will defend us?
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Old 11-28-2023, 06:30 PM   #13
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lol, we'll all be in a lawsuit by the time this saga finishes. I wonder if rvlife will defend us?

As one who has studied the law and known many "I'm going to sue" types.... but by no means a lawyer and this certainly isn't legal advice... just my anecdotal experiences....


Lot's of people are "going to sue".
Then they talk to a lawyer.
Then they realize that lawyers want paid, up front, LOT'S of money unless you have a very very good case with a large potential payout (read PERSONAL PHYSICAL INJURY).
AND... an ethical lawyer wouldn't touch this case with a 50' pole as there are no damages beyond any monies paid to alleged mechanics. Prior condition of the systems is impossible to prove so damages in that regard are zero.

So the case boils down to the value of the monies paid out and whether there is any liability for failure to provide industry standard services.
Oh yes, and the previously mentioned ability to collect in the unlikely event of winning a judgement.


Again, not a lawyer, not legal advice, just anecdotal information on how the system works.


Oh, by the way, all those "I'm going to sue" YouTubers who do activisim and say they'll sue.... very few do for exactly the reasons above. There's no significant damages to collect on and so lawyers want paid up front.
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Old 11-29-2023, 06:59 AM   #14
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Another thought:
You are fortunate that you did not successfully cage your brakes before driving. If you had you would not have brakes. Caging the brakes involves restraining the air chamber from pushing disk in it and applying the brakes. If you had one wheel stuck... maybe but I would not attempt to drive any of my vehicles with the brakes caged, period.
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Old 11-29-2023, 11:46 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cannabus View Post
I tried to move my bus after about 3 months of parking and I couldn't release the parking brakes. I was a newbie then and did not know about caging the rear brakes. I called a mechanic that I thought was familiar with air brakes but he wasn't. He had to call someone that knew. In short, I was able to drive it and I thought this guy was going to follow me. He didn't. after about eight miles, I started to lose power and pulled over to find one of my rear brakes was smoking and sizzling. I then looked at a YouTube vid on how to properly cage brakes and was able to get it to NationWide Truck Repair (avoid these guys). Told the person at the desk to see if there was permanent damage but you never know how precise the mechanics are at this place and if he was given the correct questions. Anyway, the desk clerk told me it was fine after charging me several hundred dollars.

When I got it back, I took a look and noticed that one side brake did have a lot more wear so I'll have to replace it the brakes sooner than normal.

My question is what other areas should I check or do maintenance to just incase. There was that sizzling which I believe was the bearing grease and hopefully not the rear end oil. What do you suggest. Repack the bearings, drain and replace the rearend oil, etc?

Any costs related, I will be taking the first mechanic to court to compensate me for those expenses.

Oh I remembered the first mechanic disconnected a wire I believe it was connected to a solenoid that was behind the battery compartment. Not sure what it does.


When did you realize the guy was not behind you?

C'mon, sue him? Seriously, just go burn another one and move on.
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Old 11-29-2023, 05:43 PM   #16
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This one could have been a contestant for the Darwin Awards! Wow.
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