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Old 04-06-2020, 06:36 AM   #341
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My in-laws believe all the Chinese bioweapon conspiracies.

Personally, I think the Chinese lied when this started to try to hide it, lied about the extent when they couldn't hide that it was happening, and are now lieing to claim they beat it. The estimates coming out are that the Chinese death toll is between 2x and 20x the reported numbers, so far, and that it is still going strong in parts of their country. The Chinese are arresting anyone that contradicts their narrative.

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Old 04-06-2020, 06:52 AM   #342
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I don't know who or where is started COVID-19, but my 2cents is they are up to something. Every time you have a major event we lose some kind of rights and someone gets super rich, look at 9/11 then the patriot act, then in 2008 with all the bail outs and banking law changes etc etc who knows who got rich on that deal, and now again with this. I firmly believe within a year or so there plan will come to light.
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Old 04-06-2020, 07:10 AM   #343
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All I know is when our "leadership" were telling us masks weren't anything we needed the chinese folks were saying we should definitely wear them. They warned us. The chinese have done more than this govt who called it just the flu.

They were hardcore warning us when that idiot said it would be miraculously gone in april. Watching folks defend this kind of inaction would be funny if it weren't such dire consequences.
IDK how we will be able to avoid hundreds of thousands dead.
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Old 04-06-2020, 08:13 AM   #344
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Best case is 100,000 - 240,000 dead if we do everything right. We're not...

Two things I don't understand:
1. Doesn't it defeat the purpose of "shelter in place" if we all do it at different times? One community knocks their infection rate to near zero, while the neighboring community is raging... if we can't coordinate this, we aren't much better off than if we didn't try.

2. What happens after "shelter in place?" Assuming the whole country hasn't sheltered at the same time, the infection rate starts doubling again and we are quickly right back to where we were...

There are lots of different courses of action available, each with pros and cons. Our leaders are refusing to take charge. waffling, changing their minds, and attacking each other. Our failure to nationally coordinate a strategy is the worst of all possible choices.
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Old 04-06-2020, 08:52 AM   #345
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Best case is 100,000 - 240,000 dead if we do everything right. We're not...

Two things I don't understand:
1. Doesn't it defeat the purpose of "shelter in place" if we all do it at different times? One community knocks their infection rate to near zero, while the neighboring community is raging... if we can't coordinate this, we aren't much better off than if we didn't try.

2. What happens after "shelter in place?" Assuming the whole country hasn't sheltered at the same time, the infection rate starts doubling again and we are quickly right back to where we were...

There are lots of different courses of action available, each with pros and cons. Our leaders are refusing to take charge. waffling, changing their minds, and attacking each other. Our failure to nationally coordinate a strategy is the worst of all possible choices.
Yes the failure of the potus to actually lead a unified federal effort rather than leaving such decisions to under-equipped, local government is just one of many tragedies...

On a positive note -- the more time passes with efforts to flatten the curve progress is being made on a vaccine; and people who've tested positive for covid-19 who didn't get super sick are being identified so their "natural immunity" can be analysed and used for others.
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Old 04-06-2020, 09:00 AM   #346
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Interesting, the bat quarter is intended to celebrate American Samoa ... which ironically quarantined itself in 1918 (thanks to governor John Martin Poyer) to protect people from the Spanish Influenza epidemic.
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Old 04-06-2020, 09:01 AM   #347
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My in-laws believe all the Chinese bioweapon conspiracies.

Personally, I think the Chinese lied when this started to try to hide it, lied about the extent when they couldn't hide that it was happening, and are now lieing to claim they beat it. The estimates coming out are that the Chinese death toll is between 2x and 20x the reported numbers, so far, and that it is still going strong in parts of their country. The Chinese are arresting anyone that contradicts their narrative.
I've heard the same bio-weapon theories.

I'm not sure if I believe it. People smarter then me have said that it's all a hoax. That the covid-19 has definitely come from an animal and transferred to a human. But who's to say it wasn't engineered and transmitted to an animal(bat?) first? Especially makes you wonder when a few of their nationals were caught smuggling vials of biologicals out of Harvard earlier in the year.

As far as their numbers being accurate. I don't have a clue. Knowing how china typically operates, I doubt it. But are our numbers even accurate? I've read that anybody with pre-existing conditions that dies with covid-19 is labeled as a covid-19 death. Is that realistic to do though? If you've been a smoker your entire life, have lung cancer, and get covid-19, what actually killed you? The virus or your smoking for the last 50 years? Supposedly they're all recieving covid-19 as the cause of death, which I feel isn't correct even if it "technically" is. My thought is that a person in that scenario would have likely died from the flu or pneumonia or any other illness.

The chinese government typically arrests anybody that goes against their narrative. Tiananmen square anybody?

One thing I've heard is that this was all a ploy by the chinese to stop the protests in Hong Kong. They couldn't peacefully remove them from the streets prior, so they released this as an alternative to using force. Then it went global and got out of hand.

Whatever the source or reason, it is a virus, and the only thing we can do as individuals to stop it is social distancing and quarantining. If we would all do it voluntarily, then there wouldn't be a need to suspend rights and do it by force.
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Old 04-06-2020, 09:02 AM   #348
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Mary and I had CV symptoms. The full recovery never happened, we both were down for over a week, then slowly started coming back. Took about 6 months to feel as good as we do right now but our lungs are compromised, I guess forever because this was in Jan....'18!
NEVER been sicker, my resting heart rate was 120 and I couldn't get enough o2. We were at SkooliePalooza '18 when it hit us. managed to drive home on day 4 but didn't unhook our tow or anything for over a week.
Mary was 65 and I was 72.

I think I'd like to see if I have the antibodies, maybe I can help other's.
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Old 04-06-2020, 09:45 AM   #349
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Originally Posted by Biscuitsjam View Post
Best case is 100,000 - 240,000 dead if we do everything right. We're not...

Two things I don't understand:
1. Doesn't it defeat the purpose of "shelter in place" if we all do it at different times? One community knocks their infection rate to near zero, while the neighboring community is raging... if we can't coordinate this, we aren't much better off than if we didn't try.

2. What happens after "shelter in place?" Assuming the whole country hasn't sheltered at the same time, the infection rate starts doubling again and we are quickly right back to where we were...

There are lots of different courses of action available, each with pros and cons. Our leaders are refusing to take charge. waffling, changing their minds, and attacking each other. Our failure to nationally coordinate a strategy is the worst of all possible choices.
Anything that is done to try and slow the inundation of the hospital systems is good. But not enough is being done, and without a full stay at home order for everyone it's only going to cause the infections to continue for a longer period. So we'll have multiple spikes throughout the next 2-18 months and it'll just keep happening until a vaccine is available.
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Mary and I had CV symptoms. The full recovery never happened, we both were down for over a week, then slowly started coming back. Took about 6 months to feel as good as we do right now but our lungs are compromised, I guess forever because this was in Jan....'18!
NEVER been sicker, my resting heart rate was 120 and I couldn't get enough o2. We were at SkooliePalooza '18 when it hit us. managed to drive home on day 4 but didn't unhook our tow or anything for over a week.
Mary was 65 and I was 72.

I think I'd like to see if I have the antibodies, maybe I can help other's.
Everything I've seen was it originated in bats/pangolins and was transferred to humans and first identified in Dec 2019, hence the covid-19. It's also called SARS-nCOV-2, meaning it's the second SARS coronavirus. So maybe you had SARS/Swine/Bird Flu. There's no telling how long the current virus was in humans though but if you weren't in that area or around someone that was I think it's a related-but-not-covid19.


People around here aren't taking it seriously enough. Gov. Northam said to stay at home and I also read he said one person go to the store but that wasn't necessarily part of the order. I went out for our weekly groceries yesterday, wearing a half-mask I bought years ago to filter out mold and allergens (I wear it to mow/trim). I saw parents with kids, there was a four person family in the store, including a baby, multiple couples, people still crowding the isles. I'm high risk and have high risk people living with me. It's really starting to piss me off that people are ******* around with it.
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Old 04-06-2020, 09:54 AM   #350
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The selfie generation and civic duty don't go together too well.
Pretty much everyone we know under 30 are literally mad that the rest of us don't wanna hang out anymore.

What most of these kids are missing is that its not just THEM they're supposed to care about.

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Old 04-06-2020, 09:56 AM   #351
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I've heard the same bio-weapon theories.

I'm not sure if I believe it. People smarter then me have said that it's all a hoax. That the covid-19 has definitely come from an animal and transferred to a human. But who's to say it wasn't engineered and transmitted to an animal(bat?) first? Especially makes you wonder when a few of their nationals were caught smuggling vials of biologicals out of Harvard earlier in the year.
FWIW what would make this coronavirus into a bioweapon would be having an effective vaccine or antiviral treatment for it already in hand. The apparent fact that the virus already existed in animal populations doesn't mean it's not a bioweapon.
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Old 04-06-2020, 10:01 AM   #352
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I know the epicenter of lyme disease is ALL around this lil island where the us has a military biological research facility.


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Old 04-06-2020, 10:48 AM   #353
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Without trying to cause more alarm for you, this is what's happening in Australia. This is but some of the many UN plans for the various countries.

The brief background, politically think if hillary won compared to trump, we're about 80-85% towards the hillary end of that spectrum. Chinese influence and money and corruption is rife.

We've got our parliament(equivalent of congress) shutting down until august.
Effectively abandoning their posts. An act of terrorism against the people.

social security has been effectively doubled. Because they are expecting 100% inflation between end of march and end of june.

All schools are shut, going to online delivery of classes.

We have some truly bizarre shut in rules. Like groups of no more than 2 and social distancing. But welfare lines, voting and visiting supermarkets can have as many people as they like crowded together.

All levels of government have implemented stay at home orders, and stated that they will not be lifted until a vaccine is available. 12 months minimum.

We had on our national news the family court of Australia stating that it is refusing to enforce child visitation orders. In the same news broadcast the head of the lawyers union was telling people the loop hole in legislation to use to do so. An Australian judge abandons their post when they fail to maintain the authority of their court, again an act of terrorism against the people.

we've got a parliamentary inquiry into the same court which is on hold at present until after the virus, because they still use the duluth domestic violence model. Which got banned in the usa, it's originating country, because it creates injustice. Again Australian judges and various levels of government have been engaged in a form of terrorism against the people for many years.

Australian family law, and child support laws. Now mean that after the 12-18 months for the plandemic to end. The non custodial parent loses all parental rights.

fast forward 6-12 months after that point. The parliamentary inquiry will return a result showing that the behaviour to remove the non custodial parent is child abuse. The children will then be removed from the custodial parent and placed in state care to be raised by the state.

this means about 20-25% of Australian children being raised by the state not their parents.


Do not fool yourselves, we are at war with a chinese bioweapon being used to conquer nations from within. Using corruption to commit terrorist acts against the people of the various nations.

China has already been caught out sending infected test kits to try and maximize damage in Australia and other countries.

Just my 5c, all nations will need to draw on their strengths to defeat what is planned for the people.
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Old 04-06-2020, 10:55 AM   #354
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All I know is when our "leadership" were telling us masks weren't anything we needed the chinese folks were saying we should definitely wear them. They warned us. The chinese have done more than this govt who called it just the flu.
As long as we don't confuse Chinese leakers, whom have now all magically disappeared, with the CCP.



Not sure why people are using the "conspiracy" label at this point in the game- any of these theories is a real possibility. The "Its just a flu, bro" crowd were calling anyone who thought this could impact the rest of the world conspiracy theorists two months ago when it was confined to China.


How many people want their meds made in China after this?
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Old 04-06-2020, 11:38 AM   #355
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I know the epicenter of lyme disease is ALL around this lil island where the us has a military biological research facility.
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Originally Posted by Booyah45828 View Post
I'm not sure if I believe it.
This right here is why I'm on the fence. Sometimes things are too coincidental to be a coincidence. Maybe it's just blind hope that everyone would have enough humanity to not do such a thing.

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Originally Posted by musigenesis View Post
The apparent fact that the virus already existed in animal populations doesn't mean it's not a bioweapon.
I've made that argument. Those that are "smarter" then me that supposedly understand this stuff have said that it isn't possible to create a bio-weapon that would do such a thing. I disagree, which is the point I made when I said "But who's to say it wasn't engineered and transmitted to an animal(bat?) first?" According to them, that would never happen. I don't know enough about viruses or bio-weapons to argue it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by retiredChemist View Post
Do not fool yourselves, we are at war with a chinese bioweapon being used to conquer nations from within. Using corruption to commit terrorist acts against the people of the various nations.

China has already been caught out sending infected test kits to try and maximize damage in Australia and other countries.

Just my 5c, all nations will need to draw on their strengths to defeat what is planned for the people.
I've heard the same things. The steps we're taking to combat the coronavirus essentially puts us in a war-time scenario. So does that mean we're at war? I'd say if it truly is a bioweapon then we are.


Quote:
Originally Posted by kazetsukai View Post
As long as we don't confuse Chinese leakers, whom have now all magically disappeared, with the CCP.

Not sure why people are using the "conspiracy" label at this point in the game- any of these theories is a real possibility. The "Its just a flu, bro" crowd were calling anyone who thought this could impact the rest of the world conspiracy theorists two months ago when it was confined to China.

How many people want their meds made in China after this?
Crazy isn't it?

I'm not really a fan of anything made in China. I'm not saying to buy strictly american, but a lot of the principles they have in life dictate how they operate and do business, and it isn't compatible with western ways. Cheating and theft against foreigners seems to be acceptable in their eyes. I remember when I was in college, we had to submit an essay for a final for one class and most of the chinese students plagiarized word for word the same essay that was used by a domestic student a semester prior. I know the instructor failed the cheaters, but he was supposedly over ruled by an administrator and they all received credit.

IMO, depending on any government to not take advantage of you is foolish, some more so then others.
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Old 04-06-2020, 12:29 PM   #356
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Personally, I think the Chinese lied when this started to try to hide it, lied about the extent when they couldn't hide that it was happening, and are now lieing to claim they beat it. The estimates coming out are that the Chinese death toll is between 2x and 20x the reported numbers, so far, and that it is still going strong in parts of their country. The Chinese are arresting anyone that contradicts their narrative.



I agree completely with the first part that the Chinese tried very hard to cover this up in the beginning. From my personal experience, which was primarily formed by interaction with provincial university administrations in 2 different provinces, the first reaction of anyone with authority in China is to deny and cover up any problem.

I believe that in recent years the CCP has become quite capable of pragmatism. They allowed Yang Jisheng to write his comprehensive expose of the results of Mao's stubborn piggedheadedness, which led directly to the horrendous results of the famine of 1958-1962. Yang's book was published in Mandarin in Hong Kong, and is off course banned in the Mainland, but the CCP knew exactly what Yang was up to long before he finished his research. The Party continued to let him have access to the top secret files he was researching because his research served CCP purposes. They wanted their upper echelon to be aware of the magnitude of the horrendous results of Mao's egotism.

But as to the second part of the above quotation about the disease still raging uncontrolled in some parts of China, I don't buy into that at all. I have no trouble believing that they have gotten it under control for now, because I know that since SARS China has stayed stocked up on masks. Everyone has a few masks at home, and new ones are easy to get. Just ordinary paper masks, but if EVERYBODY wears one the infection rate can be expected to drop dramatically, exactly as it appears to be in China now.

I've been wearing masks in public since this started. I am high risk, and I know it. But everytime I go out I see people who look older and/or more vulnerable than me without masks. Most of them ignore me and my mask. And of course, I see around me that younger people appear even less likely to wear a mask than older people around here.

I am in sporadic contact with a number of former students now scattered around Eastern China. They're in their 30s now and work in a variety of jobs, including one who is a TV journalist. I have decided to write to all of them at once asking for any stories they care to share about COVID-19 or what's happening in their area now in the aftermath of the outbreak.

I think that with his incredibly ham-handed response to Coronavirus, Trump is effectively enabling the Chinese to take over as the world's top economy, and I want to see at what point the Chinese people become aware of this.
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Old 04-06-2020, 01:16 PM   #357
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Without trying to cause more alarm for you, this is what's happening in Australia. This is but some of the many UN plans for the various countries.

The brief background, politically think if hillary won compared to trump, we're about 80-85% towards the hillary end of that spectrum. Chinese influence and money and corruption is rife.

We've got our parliament(equivalent of congress) shutting down until august.
Effectively abandoning their posts. An act of terrorism against the people.

social security has been effectively doubled. Because they are expecting 100% inflation between end of march and end of june.

All schools are shut, going to online delivery of classes.

We have some truly bizarre shut in rules. Like groups of no more than 2 and social distancing. But welfare lines, voting and visiting supermarkets can have as many people as they like crowded together.

All levels of government have implemented stay at home orders, and stated that they will not be lifted until a vaccine is available. 12 months minimum.

We had on our national news the family court of Australia stating that it is refusing to enforce child visitation orders. In the same news broadcast the head of the lawyers union was telling people the loop hole in legislation to use to do so. An Australian judge abandons their post when they fail to maintain the authority of their court, again an act of terrorism against the people.

we've got a parliamentary inquiry into the same court which is on hold at present until after the virus, because they still use the duluth domestic violence model. Which got banned in the usa, it's originating country, because it creates injustice. Again Australian judges and various levels of government have been engaged in a form of terrorism against the people for many years.

Australian family law, and child support laws. Now mean that after the 12-18 months for the plandemic to end. The non custodial parent loses all parental rights.

fast forward 6-12 months after that point. The parliamentary inquiry will return a result showing that the behaviour to remove the non custodial parent is child abuse. The children will then be removed from the custodial parent and placed in state care to be raised by the state.

this means about 20-25% of Australian children being raised by the state not their parents.


Do not fool yourselves, we are at war with a chinese bioweapon being used to conquer nations from within. Using corruption to commit terrorist acts against the people of the various nations.

China has already been caught out sending infected test kits to try and maximize damage in Australia and other countries.

Just my 5c, all nations will need to draw on their strengths to defeat what is planned for the people.
You rotten on paint mate?
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Old 04-06-2020, 02:30 PM   #358
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You rotten on paint mate?
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Old 04-06-2020, 03:42 PM   #359
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Boris is in ICU-
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Old 04-06-2020, 04:06 PM   #360
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A sick politician doesn't really concern me very much. As far as I am concerned, this news report about the tiger in the Bronx Zoo is far more serious in several important respects:


https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...or-coronavirus
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