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Old 05-19-2020, 08:53 AM   #981
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During a period of record unemployment, the governor decided to try to supercharge the economy. He did this by lowering the cost of doing business to try to attract employers to Florida. One initiative was to reduce the cost of unemployment insurance.

1. The unemployment payments were drastically reduced in Florida.
2. A new website was built that the designers claimed would be cheaper for the state to operate. As a side effect, the website made it much harder to claim benefits. It sounds like this "feature" was an accident, but there wasn't much incentive to fix the broken website because it saved money every time someone failed to claim benefits.

When the economy was booming, not many people complained or noticed and the media failed to inform people. When the economy screeched to a halt, the problems effected millions.
I lost my career under Rick Scott's tenure. I was gobsmacked when I found that he'd cut our federal unemployment funding.

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Old 05-19-2020, 09:02 AM   #982
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I lost my career under Rick Scott's tenure. I was gobsmacked when I found that he'd cut our federal unemployment funding.

My lifetime of republican voting was shaken at that moment and the party have done nothing to bring me back since.
There's 49 governors with better polling than the president* on their handling of this.

Georgia polls lower.

Even Scott polls better than Kemp.
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:03 AM   #983
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There's 49 governors with better polling than the president* on their handling of this.

Georgia polls lower.

Even Scott polls better than Kemp.
Oof.. that's bad.

From here it looks like DeSantis is just taking his orders from the white house.
His game plan is the same. Remove science and medicine from any of the decisions being made.

DeSantis is blaming the applicants for the unemployment not being doled out. https://www.wesh.com/article/gov-des...plied/32588757
Roxy applied many weeks ago. The call center ppl can't do anything as shown in my previous link. Its just a big circle jerk meant to frustrate you while you get no benefits.
They're not going to pay and that's just how it is.


On another note- got a conspiracy vid in my inbox recently. Its blaming root canals for all that ails humanity. It literally implores the viewer to go get their teeth pulled out ASAP. Who's to blame for so many folks abandoning science, reason, and logic?
I swear that the conspiracies have gotten so bad, so crazy that they've become their own religion.
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:17 AM   #984
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the mortality numbers are still not correct as states still arent counting those who never get sick.. which in more and more studies is 60%+ of cases never get sick.. but are still just as contagious.. if antibody tests and also ability to get tested is made easy (which no one seems to be in a hurry to do).. then we could know the true mortality rate.. south korea has better testing and has been testing more and more percentage of its population symptomatic or not.. thus they have a lower mortality rate.. the data is more complete..



here in the USA the mortality data is useless.. not to mention the most vulnerable in any pandemic die first and in higher numbers than others.. they are weaker.. it way too early in this thing to decide how lethal it is..



as for states re-opening.. stay home if you dont like it.. no one wants to be stuck in cold dark depressing houses like I keep saying.. yes there are things that can be done out in public to help minimize the risks.. getting people on-board with that should be more urgent and important than locking people up in their houses..
Isn't that an overly simplistic and selfish view of it though? "Suck it up Buttercup" to paraphrase what you're saying.

I can't stay home. I've been working throughout, being careful and very grateful to be earning. But the more people out and about without masks and without distancing, the more at risk I am.

My kids mom was forced to go back to work or lose unemployment. She's a retail manager in a mall. She's allowed to bring back two employees total, two people working at a time, covering 12 hour shifts every single day. She's higher risk with health problems but she has to expose herself so people not returning to work can come buy cheap clothing with their extra money. And she can't bring in enough people to limit that risk.

The mall gave out 10000 masks in a few days now they're out and it's about 50% wearing them. She going to get it and pass it on to her 75 year old mom who lives with her.

Keeping everything closed forever is not the goal and that's just as bad as your suggestion. But our numbers haven't decreased and their altering their stats and nobody around here is being smart when they do leave their house.

25000 people out on Tybee island this weekend. That's not a big enough place to keep up with social distancing with that crowd. And maybe on the beach in the heat it's not easily spread, but I had to pick up my (grown ass should've known better adult) stepson from there at 9pm. Every bar was jam packed. Every crosswalk was jam packed. It was an hour drive to get the two miles off the island.

Now it's just going to spread from there.

Go out, sure but be smart and think about the rest of us. Americans are a bunch of selfish a holes.
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:29 AM   #985
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Georgia Governor Kemp was elected after numerous allegations of voter fraud. At the time, he was both running for office and responsible for counting the votes. Democrats widely believe he stole the election.

The Georgia State legislature voted Kemp emergency powers when this started and then went home. The governor didn't make an appearance for weeks, then criticized all the cities shutting down schools, etc.

He finally ordered a shelter in place, but it was half-assed, unenforced, and without the governor really backing it. He declared that he waited so long because he had no idea that there were asymptomatic carriers (the incompetence defense). In effect, the economy slammed to a halt but people didn't social distance so we got the worst of both worlds.

He decided to open up the state despite not meeting any of the federal guidelines. When questioned by the media, he refused to explain his reasoning. Then, Trump criticized him for opening too soon.

So, right now, both sides of the aisle are piling on Governor Kemp. Whether he did too much or not enough, few trust him to make good decisions or to be able to explain his choices.

For the last two weeks, the infection rate has held steady. However, it takes about 2 weeks between infection and testing for most people. The next week will tell what trajectory we're on.
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:32 AM   #986
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Thanks for being in this conversation, Biscuits. Its a nice place for us different folks from different states to openly and frankly discuss this stuff.
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:41 AM   #987
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HUGE parties all over FL over the weekend. My neighbors stayed up from Friday to Sunday drinking. Must have been a hundred people there.

Look at this-
https://www.arklatexhomepage.com/vid...eople/5516886/
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:43 AM   #988
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thus my point as to why enforcement of masking rules and distancing needs to be vigilant.. I dont give a **** if you call me an asshole.. yes I wear my mask in public buildings and customer sites..



but ultimately nothing is being done on the "mask up wash up" side.. its either the liberal agenda of Lock-us-down so we can sit at home and live for free.. or its the conservatives side of lets just free-roll...



all im here to say is that neither plan is going to work right because its all or nothing..



yep the virus has some type of mortality rate.. all I said is we dont know what it really is yet... its too early.. yep its killed 90k..


Cancer kills 500K every year.. but I dont see society getting shoved in a box ******* the economy into oblivion over that.. we still spray roundup on plants, we still smoke zillions of cigarettes a year, we still put aspartame in diet pop, we still make plastic everything that has cancer causing chemicals.. why not? I have no idea..


again call me whatever the hell you want to call me I dont care..


all im saying is this crying and whimpering and "keep us locked down" isnt going to fix it.. flatten-the-curve never was designed to contain... we already knew its going to be bad.. and if you say "dont monetize life" then stay home without any pay and see how that works out for you.. locking everyone down means forcing many more home with no pay.. UE isnt available to a HUGE number of people..


again im not advocating a no-mask free-for-all although I do debate health risks on wearing masks outside exercising.. my Oxygen saturation meter proves my point there.. but inside public spaces distancing and masks can and do work.. enforcement is needed.. and here in ohio im sure all of you saw the pictures of the crowded bar patios this weekend.. several of those places are now shut down.. so yeah they are trying at least...
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:45 AM   #989
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thus my point as to why enforcement of masking rules and distancing needs to be vigilant.. I dont give a **** if you call me an asshole.. yes I wear my mask in public buildings and customer sites..



but ultimately nothing is being done on the "mask up wash up" side.. its either the liberal agenda of Lock-us-down so we can sit at home and live for free.. or its the conservatives side of lets just free-roll...



all im here to say is that neither plan is going to work right because its all or nothing..



yep the virus has some type of mortality rate.. all I said is we dont know what it really is yet... its too early.. yep its killed 90k..


Cancer kills 500K every year.. but I dont see society getting shoved in a box ******* the economy into oblivion over that.. we still spray roundup on plants, we still smoke zillions of cigarettes a year, we still put aspartame in diet pop, we still make plastic everything that has cancer causing chemicals.. why not? I have no idea..


again call me whatever the hell you want to call me I dont care..


all im saying is this crying and whimpering and "keep us locked down" isnt going to fix it.. flatten-the-curve never was designed to contain... we already knew its going to be bad.. and if you say "dont monetize life" then stay home without any pay and see how that works out for you.. locking everyone down means forcing many more home with no pay.. UE isnt available to a HUGE number of people..


again im not advocating a no-mask free-for-all although I do debate health risks on wearing masks outside exercising.. my Oxygen saturation meter proves my point there.. but inside public spaces distancing and masks can and do work.. enforcement is needed.. and here in ohio im sure all of you saw the pictures of the crowded bar patios this weekend.. several of those places are now shut down.. so yeah they are trying at least...

Cancer isn't contagious.
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:51 AM   #990
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Cancer isn't a contagious virus, Chris. I dont' think this is a political "lock us down" debate. Most of us staying with the thread seem to all agree that folks not taking it seriously is THE biggest problem.
We have a contagious virus going around. But folks ignoring it isn't making it go away. Only personal responsibility from the bottom to the top can make it go away. Since that's not going to happen this is going to continue to be a mostly unmitigated disaster till a vaccine comes along. Then we'll have to figure out how to handle the anti-vaxxers. No matter how we go about it its going to be a totally uphill battle.
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Old 05-19-2020, 09:55 AM   #991
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on to something totally positive-
On our 9th "stay at home" monday we got the official announcement that the Scottish Premier Football League finally scrapped the remaining 8 games of the season and declared Celtic champions!
Finally something to celebrate! NINE league titles in a row. Making history !



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Old 05-19-2020, 10:33 AM   #992
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Cancer isn't a contagious virus, Chris. I dont' think this is a political "lock us down" debate. Most of us staying with the thread seem to all agree that folks not taking it seriously is THE biggest problem.
We have a contagious virus going around. But folks ignoring it isn't making it go away. Only personal responsibility from the bottom to the top can make it go away. Since that's not going to happen this is going to continue to be a mostly unmitigated disaster till a vaccine comes along. Then we'll have to figure out how to handle the anti-vaxxers. No matter how we go about it its going to be a totally uphill battle.
We are supposed to be "self-governing". I think we're doing a horrible job of that in all aspects including this virus response.

@ Cadillac I wasn't trying to call you names. I meant all of us in general. I took your first statement as more cut-and-dry then your explanation implies. I think we're making the same point.
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Old 05-19-2020, 02:56 PM   #993
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starting to see more reports of children getting affected by covid. this may force some folks to take it more seriously.
https://www.wesh.com/article/florida...lness/32600598
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Old 05-19-2020, 03:47 PM   #994
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for some reason children infections were never making it to the news till recently.. however medical professionals were seeing them.. I think now they are learning about some of the complications that can happen in Small percentages of kids so now the media deems it newsworthy (not sure why they didnt before)...



more and more businesses here are requiring folks to mask up.. even for kids. one local merchant was offering extra perks points to customers that pick up their carryout at the curb wearing a mask..(they are not opening their dining area anytime soon as they feel they cant maintain proper distancing).



some people are vowing to only frequent businesses that require masking.. this to me is the free market! talk with your $$ not your mouth.. I dig this approach..
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Old 05-19-2020, 03:48 PM   #995
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for some reason children infections were never making it to the news till recently.. however medical professionals were seeing them.. I think now they are learning about some of the complications that can happen in Small percentages of kids so now the media deems it newsworthy (not sure why they didnt before)...



more and more businesses here are requiring folks to mask up.. even for kids. one local merchant was offering extra perks points to customers that pick up their carryout at the curb wearing a mask..(they are not opening their dining area anytime soon as they feel they cant maintain proper distancing).



some people are vowing to only frequent businesses that require masking.. this to me is the free market! talk with your $$ not your mouth.. I dig this approach..
According to the Dr's it shows up weeks after the initial infection. Its an inflammatory disease of some sort possibly related to Kawasaki.
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Old 05-19-2020, 05:25 PM   #996
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Really not trying to cause conflict here, but here it goes.....

I have read tons here about masking up, forced closures, numbers rising, defiance to political directives, and so on, and so on, and so on.......

Can someone explain to me how South Dakota Governor has issued ZERO directives on closing anything, no travel bans, no mask wearing directives. They have the lowest percentage of Covid related deaths, by almost double the next lowest state. She came out in the beginning and said she wasn't going to try to force her citizens to do anything because she knew they would do what was best on their own. And they have!

Anyone care to enlighten me?
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Old 05-19-2020, 05:27 PM   #997
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Really not trying to cause conflict here, but here it goes.....

I have read tons here about masking up, forced closures, numbers rising, defiance to political directives, and so on, and so on, and so on.......

Can someone explain to me how South Dakota Governor has issued ZERO directives on closing anything, no travel bans, no mask wearing directives. They have the lowest percentage of Covid related deaths, by almost double the next lowest state. She came out in the beginning and said she wasn't going to try to force her citizens to do anything because she knew they would do what was best on their own. And they have!

Anyone care to enlighten me?
I'm sure population density is a big part of that. I don't see a big tourism industry there either.
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Old 05-19-2020, 05:46 PM   #998
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I'm sure population density is a big part of that. I don't see a big tourism industry there either.
When you take into account the positive case numbers vs death toll, population density has nothing to do with it. Acording to the official CDC web site, if you want to believe that government driven entity, South Dakota mortality rate is .004%, the next closest I saw was at .02%, that's taking into account high density population states like New York and low density states like Montana. South Dakota still has it figured out, and nobody has had to loose their jobs to do it either. One town north of me has gone from about a 7% unemployment rate to 80% because of forced business closures. Didn't happen in South Dakota.

I guess what I'm driving at is there are a few smart politicians, but most of them are just plain and simply STUPID!

As for your mentioned gatherings of thousands out on the beaches, I refer back to one of my favorite movie quotes. "A person is smart, people are stupid!" When you can talk to and reason with one person at a time, they will usually understand. When you dump 3000 people onto a public beach together, they are all as dumb as the sand they are standing on!
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Old 05-19-2020, 06:02 PM   #999
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When you take into account the positive case numbers vs death toll, population density has nothing to do with it. Acording to the official CDC web site, if you want to believe that government driven entity, South Dakota mortality rate is .004%, the next closest I saw was at .02%, that's taking into account high density population states like New York and low density states like Montana. South Dakota still has it figured out, and nobody has had to loose their jobs to do it either. One town north of me has gone from about a 7% unemployment rate to 80% because of forced business closures. Didn't happen in South Dakota.

I guess what I'm driving at is there are a few smart politicians, but most of them are just plain and simply STUPID!

As for your mentioned gatherings of thousands out on the beaches, I refer back to one of my favorite movie quotes. "A person is smart, people are stupid!" When you can talk to and reason with one person at a time, they will usually understand. When you dump 3000 people onto a public beach together, they are all as dumb as the sand they are standing on!
Florida is just a big cruise ship at this point.
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Old 05-19-2020, 06:18 PM   #1000
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There are two reasons to do a shelter in place:

CONTAINMENT:
If you want to contain the virus, you need a 2-3 month, strictly-enforced shelter order, followed by widespread testing, restricted entry from outside, and aggressive contact tracing to identify hotspots early. If successful, you can gradually open back up and go back to life as normal. Nobody in the U.S. even attempted containment.

FLATTEN THE CURVE

The goal here is not to contain the virus. The virus will keep coming back until 60-80% of the population is infected. Once that happens, transmission will slow dramatically. Then, a vaccine has the potential to eradicate Covid-19 if widely distributed.

The goal is to slow the virus transmission so this happens over 2 years and not over 6 months. Success means that your hospitals are never overwhelmed. Success does NOT mean that you prevent people from getting COVID 19. Ideally, as you shelter, hospitals are near capacity but never overwhelmed. Then, once cases go to near zero, open back up again and try to slow the spread as much as possible with widespread testing, bans on large gatherings, and aggressive contact tracing. Chances are, though, you'll need to shut down a second time and maybe a third...

Most shelter in place orders accomplished little - they were too late and not extreme enough to contain the virus. However, they were also too early to really be effective in flattening the curve. Here's the problem - if few people had COVID, that means your population is still defenseless... Without more testing or contact tracing or social distancing, it'll spread as fast now as if we did nothing.

Our government knows this, but all publicized projections are just about what happens before August.... If the deaths are delayed until September, they don't count? Or will we shut down the country again in August and then in January and in May and....

My opinion? As far as South Dakota goes, if their hospitals aren't overwhelmed, then they were right to wait. New York was right to do their shelter as they did. Everybody else screwed it up.
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