Future of fueling our skoolies?

[s2mikon]

Yes. I was in CA and had a diesel MBZ and was paying 79 cents in the early 80's.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by shorthair

Yeah Portlands light rail works so well that when it freezes or gets above about the mid 90s the wires sag too much or they ice up and shut the whole system down. Real good planning by the local politicians NOT.

the dayton system doesnt seem to have that issue.. im guessing it was built for the real cold and real hot that we get in ohio fairly often.. when I was in boston in both winter and summer theirs appeared to be operating as normal too..



yet another reason for me to not ever move to the left coast...

[Doktari]

Gas is $6.75/gal at the station I went to in Germany yesterday. Not sure about diesel. In USA Ive got several aging large vehicles with big fuel hungry engines. I’m trying not to pour too much money into them. But at least even if fuel prices go out of reach they can be used for something. Either someone can live in them or they can be used for storage. Buses are a decent investment just for storage. I just had two buses that would not start that had always started before. Not sure if they will ever run again. Both non-running buses are gas buses. That’s one big advantage of diesel buses. Looks like next Summer I’ll be draining old gas and getting these rigs running. A lot of effort and expense not knowing if the transmissions and brakes still work. But with prices of rigs so high I might be able to sell them and recoup some of the cash. But not get paid for my time. They are starting to feel like a liability.

[cadillackid]

sad to throw perfectly good busses away by making them storage sheds! so many classics are ruined in this manner

[DeMac]

Originally Posted by cadillackid

sad to throw perfectly good busses away by making them storage sheds! so many classics are ruined in this manner

Many storage buses are still a (varmint) home for full-time skoolie living. Some multi-family skoolies have several species.

(not my coop)

[s2mikon]

Is that your coop? That could be nice for 50 birds.

[MilesOriginal]

Science is provable, politics are belief. I think you're misunderstanding the terms.

[rossvtaylor]

Without getting political...at least in the sense of not putting things in partisan terms...the political environment pendulum swings back and forth. So, my prediction is that diesel prices will continue to remain high and possibly rise for another year or two...then I guess there will be shifts in the makeup of the government and prices will drop again.

I remember when we all were told that incandescent light bulbs would be outlawed and no longer available...but we can still buy them. I expect the same situation applies to diesel and I'm not expecting it to go away anytime soon. As someone above said...not in my lifetime.

[turf]

i suspect the switch to electric could come much faster than we think.


sure...your opinion of the stuff available now is crap.... but its getting better.

if the electric f150 comes out and lives up to hype, it will move the pendulum quickly.
faster, more power, better torque, fewer moving parts, and cheaper to operate will be hard to compete with.
they estimate the equivelant of a gallon of gas is $1 in electiricty......that adds up fast

[joeblack5]

I have some 20 vehicles, xjsv12, 73 Corvette, Citroen DS, several Mercedes wagon, a Mercedes g, lada niva, couple of jeeps, several unimogs, several busses and a couple of electric cars.,

For daily use I love the electric ones.. zero maintenance, $0.01/mile for the geo metro and $0.03/mile for the S10 pick up truck. With our solar I am indepent, no fuel taxes, no government and truly free. Couple of solar panels and that is all.

Electric is good for 90% of the average people.
I remember coming in 1993 from the netherlands to the USA and laughing everytime I filled up my F250 diesel...so cheap..now with electric I am laughing even more.

People cause impact on the environment, sometimes unavoidable but it is nice to attempt to minimize it.
$6/gallon makes you think a little more.

Diesel will be around for a long time but the regulators will catch up.

In the 80 the I traveled to Switzerland in an old Russian lada niva. When we left it had leaked a couple of drops of motor oil on the concrete parking lot that was also the top of their fallout shelter.. the swiss were pretty upset and cleaned it up .. then , ...I thought that was ridiculous...
Now 40 years later I think it is ridiculous that we do not have a decent vehicle inspection in the USA...some call that freedom..
Ha ,the future is around the corner, it will be a hard reality for our kids.

Johan

[bus-bro]

What I'd want in a battery electric vehicle is a pick-up truck. Not those vanity things that they plan to build. Just need a truck to go to the dump and the lumber store. Up tp 60 mph and a 100+ mile range. But that ain't the thing that they're going to build.

[Ronnie]

Originally Posted by joeblack5

I have some 20 vehicles, xjsv12, 73 Corvette, Citroen DS, several Mercedes wagon, a Mercedes g, lada niva, couple of jeeps, several unimogs, several busses and a couple of electric cars.,

For daily use I love the electric ones.. zero maintenance, $0.01/mile for the geo metro and $0.03/mile for the S10 pick up truck. With our solar I am indepent, no fuel taxes, no government and truly free. Couple of solar panels and that is all.

Electric is good for 90% of the average people.
I remember coming in 1993 from the netherlands to the USA and laughing everytime I filled up my F250 diesel...so cheap..now with electric I am laughing even more.

People cause impact on the environment, sometimes unavoidable but it is nice to attempt to minimize it.
$6/gallon makes you think a little more.

Diesel will be around for a long time but the regulators will catch up.

In the 80 the I traveled to Switzerland in an old Russian lada niva. When we left it had leaked a couple of drops of motor oil on the concrete parking lot that was also the top of their fallout shelter.. the swiss were pretty upset and cleaned it up .. then , ...I thought that was ridiculous...
Now 40 years later I think it is ridiculous that we do not have a decent vehicle inspection in the USA...some call that freedom..
Ha ,the future is around the corner, it will be a hard reality for our kids.

Johan

Decent vehicle inspection scare me more then anything because anything not factory will become suspect, many of your vehicles, and mine to will not pass a government inspection. Who certifies an engine change to be"safe", a skoolie body on a unimog how will that pass inspection? So freedom I hope will stay with us, it is after all why others come here, and what this country is all about. I really agree with everything else you say, after all we seem to be kindred spirits.

[cadillackid]

Originally Posted by rossvtaylor

Without getting political...at least in the sense of not putting things in partisan terms...the political environment pendulum swings back and forth. So, my prediction is that diesel prices will continue to remain high and possibly rise for another year or two...then I guess there will be shifts in the makeup of the government and prices will drop again.

I remember when we all were told that incandescent light bulbs would be outlawed and no longer available...but we can still buy them. I expect the same situation applies to diesel and I'm not expecting it to go away anytime soon. As someone above said...not in my lifetime.

you can already see it.. the government starting to backpeddle on the aggressiveness of fossil fuel phase out.. the society as a whiole isnt having the swiftmess.. the pushback is gaining steam.. one of the reasons for high prices is oil companies being reluctant to put any capital $$ into drilling if their product is going to be obsoleted without a good ROI... a few years ago when prices rose oil companies drilled like crazy because they felt theiur product had a long lifespan.. politically the pushback is already lengthening the viability of their product so in the next year we may see abit of drilling pick up and hold gas prices in the vicinity they are now or lower them a bit..

[cadillackid]

Certain states still have very little inspection.. Ohio is one.. if I buy and register a vehicle I can pretty much turn it into anything I want as long as it has the typical stuff.. lights wipers etc..

While technically you can’t delete emission controls, in all but I think one county in Ohio there is zero inspection.. you order your tags by mail and even if I sell a vehicle the next owner if in state never has to physically produce more than the title to get it plated .. no physical inspection of it.

If I buy one out of state and bring it to Ohio the only inspection is to make sure the title vin and physical vin match .. that’s it

[Zork]

Originally Posted by Rbru8030

Is anyone having thoughts about the future of diesel fuel going forward? I'm still waiting on my county here in NC to give me a price on the bus we're hoping to buy and I'm trying to cover all the facets of routine monthly costs for budgeting. I also heard that the gov is trying to get older engine buses off the road. This is just a rumor as far as I know and I'm looking for input from anyone willing to share their thoughts on these topics with a noobie?

Rich

I wouldn't worry about it. Recently I saw a presentation of a company that converts recycled plastics back into fuel, much cleaner than what you get at the pump. In addition, the commercial transportation sector in the country depends on diesel, and it will be many decades before they come up with a way to phase it out without destroying the industries that depend on those trucks. California can do what they want, but they can't force diesel skoolies and RV's out without destroying a significant chunk of their income from vacationers and sightseers. Europe has been making noises about diesel, but so far all they have done is ban *some* vehicles from city centers, for good reason. But it depends on how "clean" your diesel vehicle is.

[LargeMargeInBaja]

Originally Posted by dzl_

.
[edited]
.
[I am amused by] how much grumbling about California come from people outside...I hope we can just stop with the little political digs and rants, its not constructive.

.
dzl,
I grew-up on a farm in the mountains east of Sacramento, California.
I like the climate and the rural folk.
I like the access to the Delta and coast.
.
I have zero-zero-zero appreciation for California bureaucratsss.
Because of California bureaucratsss, I abandoned the place decades ago.
.
Visiting family on our acreage -- in the mountains east of Sacramento -- is physically and spiritually painful to me.
One example:
* the bureaucratsss' ridiculous taxes on fuel means I must fill my auxiliary tanks in Oregon at about two dollars less per gallon, hauling that extra weight, then re-crossing the Oregon border (back to some semblance of sanity...) with a few gallons to spare.
.
On top of those asinine taxes, California bureaucratsss demand purchase taxes.
Taxes on taxes.
I never waste a nickel buying anything in California.
As soon as I cross the border from Oregon, my money loses a big chunk of purchase power.
Those taxes hurt... in a 'not constructive' way.
Would I purchase tires, batteries, photovoltaic, any big-ticket acquisition in California?
Heck, I am barely able to stop at a local-owned family-operated Mexican bakery in Los Molinos for my dietary-required cinnamon/brown-sugar arejas ('ears').
The rest of it... not a chance.
.
I am not a California resident, so I was unable to vote against those taxes.
I am not a California resident, so I receive zero-zero-zero value from those taxes.
.
My 'little digs' against California are not about Californians.
My 'little digs' are about bureaucratsss with the power to destroy, self-important tin-hat big-shot loud-mouths, and governess/governor supporters of no-good do-nothings... as long as the wasted money comes from the wallets and bank-accounts of working folk.
.
"Just keep your hands off our benefits and retirement packages!"
.
.
I think that about covers it.
Synopsis:
* constructive versus destructive
* California and Californians, constructive working folk -- YES!
* destructive bureaucratsss, destructive taxes, destructive bums/bumettes -- nope.
.
.
An aside:
Would I travel through frisco, san angeles/los diego, modesto/stock-town, anyplace south of Redding?
Maybe... in a convey of Bradley Fighting Vehicles.
With air cover.
Other than that, probably not.
.
.
My final word:
* knowing the propensity of California bureaucratsss to muck it up, I bet they probably require holes in the roof.
Makes perfect sense [sarc]

[Zork]

I used to live in California back in the 80's. The state is unrecognizable to me now. To me, California is a great place to visit, but not a very good place to live. To each his own.

[s2mikon]

Every year, moving company United Van Lines releases data on the number of people joining or leaving each state, other than Hawaii and Alaska. In United's 2021 report — based on last year's moves — work is the No. 1 reason to leave, with 40% of those moving doing so. Last year it moved up to #5. The year before it was #7. So where is the work going to? This type of survey is not real accurate because many people don’t use a moving company, they rent a truck and do their own move. So what is the real number? Estimates are all over the map. We do know that California lost a House of Representatives Seat in Congress this year, and Texas gained 2 seats, Florida, Oregon Montana, Colorado and N Carolina all gained 1 seat. So the population is shifting. Each seat in Congress is about 700,000 people, so about ¾ of a million people may have have left California. California is not the only state to loose population, Michigan, Ohio, New York, Illinois, West Virginia and Pennsylvania also lost a House seat each too. This is problematic for those left behind because those that moved were paying taxes to support the State, and to make up the difference those left behind will have to pay more. Also you have to consider that Federal money spent on states is based on population. If your population drops the local government must now pick up the tab, meaning the taxpayers. So why would so many people leave for Florida and Texas? To keep this bus related is it easier to register a bus conversion in California or Texas or Florida? Where is diesel fuel cheaper? Where are the State taxes lower? Some people vote with their feet.

[Zork]

You're missing an important part of the equation. When so many people move, yes, tax collection suffers, but the expense of providing taxpayer-funded expenses also goes with them and gets transferred to where they move. Not exactly a net-zero calculation but Newton's Third Law applies just as well. Those other states will also have to adjust. The population is not getting younger, it's getting older, and all those baby-boomers will need more and more expensive services. That's pretty much the same across the board. Lots of people do research and crunch numbers around all of this, but to me only Chaos Theory can cover it all.

[DeMac]

Originally Posted by s2mikon

Every year, moving company United Van Lines releases data on the number of people joining or leaving each state, (....edited for length....) So why would so many people leave for Florida and Texas? To keep this bus related is it easier to register a bus conversion in California or Texas or Florida? Where is diesel fuel cheaper? Where are the State taxes lower? Some people vote with their feet.

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Vehicle registration taxes are low, here in Florida. No income tax either. Property tax is also low (I pay <$10 an acre, annually), we bought gas & milk yesterday. $3.40/gal-gas, $4.50/gal-milk.

FL Registration fees are determined by the vehicle weight (net, not gross), body type, vehicle type and registration use.

Motorcycles $10.00
Moped $5.00
Antique motorcycle $7.50
Antique automobile $7.50
Automobiles (Net weight up to 2,499 pounds) $14.50
Automobiles (2,500 - 3,499 pounds) $22.50
Automobiles (3,500 or more pounds) $32.50
Trucks (Net weight up to 1,999 pounds) $14.50
Trucks -based on weight (2,000 - 3,000 pounds) $22.50
Trucks -based on weight (3,001 - 5,000 pounds) $32.50
Heavy Truck (5,001 - 5,999 pounds) $60.75
Heavy Truck/Tractor (Agriculture 150 miles) $87.75
Heavy Truck/Tractor $324.00
Semitrailers per registration year $13.50
Semitrailers permanent registration $68.00
Special Purpose Vehicles $44.00
School Buses $41.00
Wrecker $41.00
Recreational Vehicles (5th wheel) $27.00
Recreational Vehicles (camping trailer) $13.50
Recreational Vehicles (under 4,500lbs) $27.00
Recreational Vehicles (over 4,500 lbs) $47.50
Goat Truck $7.50
Antique Truck $7.50

*Licensing*
Original Class E (includes Learner’s license)$48.00
Original/Renewal CDL$75.00
Original School Board CDL $48.00
Renewal Class E$48.00
Renewal School Board CDL$48.00
Endorsements $7.00
Knowledge retest$10.00
Identification Cards (Original, Renewal & Replacement) $25.00


Florida is also a Right to Work state. We are more free to make choices for ourselves and our families.