Help! On the road far from home and will not start!

david.dgeorge07 · 10-15-2018, 06:44 PM

Been on the road for nearly a week. No problems. Stopped at a rest area for 5 minutes.

Went to restart bus and no crank.

Plenty of battery. Stared fine multiple times today. Checked all fuses and swapped some relays.

Last summer had a cable lug break on the alternator, so thought maybe I had something similar happen on the starter but so far cannot find any cables that aren’t secure.

In 1.5 years owning never had a starting problem. No recent mods or electrical work.

I am at a rest area in Ohio on hwy 30 eastbound close to slabtown road.

Maybe this link works?

https://maps.app.goo.gl/khExk1sX7eVUNfky2

Any advice or assistance much appreciated!

David

Ronnie · 10-15-2018, 07:02 PM

Do you have a test light or electric meter? If so test power to the starter both main power and the solenoid wire. Key has to be in start position to test for power to the solenoid. If no meter or test light you can jump from the main power terminal on the starter to the solenoid terminal and see if it cranks. Use a short piece of wire or if there is room a screwdriver. Just be careful about what you touch. There are a lot of amps here. It may or may not start so be prepared.

david.dgeorge07 · 10-15-2018, 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ronnie

Do you have a test light or electric meter? If so test power to the starter both main power and the solenoid wire. Key has to be in start position to test for power to the solenoid. If no meter or test light you can jump from the main power terminal on the starter to the solenoid terminal and see if it cranks. Use a short piece of wire or if there is room a screwdriver. Just be careful about what you touch. There are a lot of amps here. It may or may not start so be prepared.

Thanks for responding! I do have a meter, but no way to do both key and meter at once. I have wire and a screwdriver but my starter looks different that ones I have seen so not sure which terminals I’m looking for.

I will try to post pics.

david.dgeorge07 · 10-15-2018, 07:09 PM

IMG_8032.PNG

IMG_8033.PNG

david.dgeorge07 · 10-15-2018, 07:19 PM

IMG_8037.PNG

End view

BlackJohn · 10-15-2018, 07:20 PM

If those are positive cable connections in the pics, it is no wonder there is no power. Atrocious, but not something to fix alongside the hwy.

Try as Ronnie says to short the start solenoid and be careful doing that.
Get the bus home and clean both pos and neg terminals/cable ends wherever they are. Go right through the whole system and clean it up.
Good luck George. Watching as this progresses.

John

david.dgeorge07 · 10-15-2018, 07:32 PM

I’m trying to figure out which terminals to bridge. I see a + stamped on the end of one of the studs, but don’t know where to go to. Certainly don’t want to accidentally short to ground.

Ronnie · 10-15-2018, 07:50 PM

the one with the positive on it should be from the battery, and would be main power to the starter. It is hard to see in the picture but there should be a small wire 12 gauge or so that actually engages the solenoid this is what you want to jump to.

Ronnie · 10-15-2018, 07:56 PM

looking at the end view, think it is just to the left of the + terminal and much smaller.

You may have to take apart and clean the connections. Yes better done at home as it is possible to twist off the studs. However if you take it apart , disconnect the battery first!!!!!

david.dgeorge07 · 10-15-2018, 08:17 PM

Got it to start with a screwdriver! You guys were right!

Ronnie · 10-15-2018, 08:21 PM

Glad to hear you are going again.

BlackJohn · 10-15-2018, 08:37 PM

That is good to hear David. I guess you are not near home but I would spray those connections with penetrating oil or wd40 right away and that will help at removal for cleaning.

At least you can run and be warm now but without proper tools to clean that all up good, I would be thinking of heading home for a while.

John

EastCoastCB · 10-15-2018, 10:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by david.dgeorge07

Got it to start with a screwdriver! You guys were right!

BlackJohn has taught me a few things about electricity in vehicles!!!

david.dgeorge07 · 10-16-2018, 09:56 AM

Made it home! Drove straight thru without shutting it down! We’ll see what I find, but my money is on a bad wire somewhere. So many bundles of relativity thin wires combined with tension and vibration.

BlackJohn · 10-16-2018, 01:41 PM

So glad you made it home ok. Did you have to fuel up and leave it running?

Good luck with the repairs, it'll be better than ever.

John

BlackJohn · 10-16-2018, 01:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EastCoastCB

BlackJohn has taught me a few things about electricity in vehicles!!!

Kind words there CB. You have been paying attention, but my bus knowledge in general pales in comparison to yours. Man you should be in the business, you can do it.

Electricity is an interesting phenomena and I think you have the bug now that you are getting more comfortable with it/around it. Every bus is the same that way basically electrically and diesels may differ a bit but they all work on similar principles. All you people for that matter should get to know how they work together to make your bus experince an enjoyable one and fairly easy on the pocketbook.

John

david.dgeorge07 · 10-16-2018, 02:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlackJohn

So glad you made it home ok. Did you have to fuel up and leave it running?

Good luck with the repairs, it'll be better than ever.

John

Sure did! It was a long haul but uneventful. The bus did fantastic coming through the Appalachians on 75 south in Kentucky and into TN. Some decent grades in there and I even passed a few folks!

david.dgeorge07 · 10-16-2018, 03:04 PM

IMG_8041.PNG

I believe this is the starter relay. Doing a crash course in starter wiring.

Working backwards from the starter solenoid I bridged the two heavy terminals on top of this relay and it started right up. It seems like the small terminal on the lower left is ground, but I don’t know why it is red.

I assume that the terminal adjacent to that comes from the upstream +12V that should activate the relay when I turn the key to start or push the start button in the engine bay.

One confusing fact is that the start button seems to have +12V on both terminals BEFORE I push the button.

Next steps: confirm relay wiring schematic, test relay for operation, and assuming that it is good, follow the path upstream.

david.dgeorge07 · 10-16-2018, 03:37 PM

Starter relay is good and the above picture is labeled correctly.

Now I need to follow the purple wire to see where it leads.

At least I can start it reliably now without getting underneath, getting filthy, craning around and hoping I don’t stick a screwdriver in the wrong place!

There is a lot of cleanup to do with various connections, but I don’t want to touch anything that I don’t have reason to believe is currently responsible for the no start situation. Seems like it is asking for trouble and confusion.

I know for sure now that the high energy part of the system is working fine so I just got to chase down the missing link between the key/button and the relay.

cadillackid · 10-16-2018, 04:22 PM

glad you made it home.. im in savannah or I couldve come to you.. i know that rest area.. or at least i think I do.. sounbds familiar. somewhat close to I-75. I think..

-Christopher

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