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-   -   Veggie conversion questions. (

Robin97396 02-29-2016 05:51 PM

Veggie conversion questions.
I've read a lot of this information on the use of old fry oil. That part isn't confusing. Some people that are using fry oil for their vehicles have these complicated processing plants in their garages where the oil is not only heavily filtered, but also has chemicals added to remove the lanolin. Apparently some of you are simply filtering the oil very well and feeding it to your bus with pretty good results.

Is it simply different types of injectors and pumps that dictate how processed the oil has to be? I understood that straight fry oil would gum up your pump and injectors on a regular diesel engine.

I've got three multifuel engines that run on anything from alcohol to grease, but this type of injector pump has a fuel density compensater built into it. I'd even be afraid of gumming those engines up by burning fry oil.

Am I misunderstanding your process of preparing oil for use as fuel?

sdwarf36 03-01-2016 12:24 AM

No chemicals added for me. You get the oil clean enough-and warm enough it won't gum anything up. Some motors like it better than others-but no changes needed to pumps or injectors. From anything I've read on WVO sites, 5.9's are fine with it. I converted a 24 valve-but can't attest to any long term reliability. Earlier motors are better with it.
Only first hand info I can give is 7.3 Fords. They LOVE it.

cowlitzcoach 03-01-2016 01:07 AM

Mechanically controlled engines will tolerate WVO.

The increased pressures in the electronically controlled pumps and injectors in newer engines can cause some real problems if you use WVO. Even blends in excess of 10% bio-diesel can cause some real problems.

Tango 03-01-2016 11:09 AM

Based on what I have read there is also the water issue. Seems most WVO has much higher water content that needs to be 99.99% eliminated or it will cause major issues. The article I saw a while back described serious rusting on the rings and cylinders as well as just about throughout the fuel system. I'm no veggie fuel expert so consider this a question.

Robin97396 03-01-2016 01:15 PM

The next question would be how to get the water out. Oil floats on water, so maybe a drain plug in the lowest point of the WVO tank? I'm assuming heating the oil can't get rid of the water, or effectively steam it off, because of being covered by oil.

Also, I'm sure there is a certain amount of sludge from the french fries or burritos. What do you do with the unusable leftovers? I'd imagine this clogs up filters pretty fast or has someone figured a cheaper way to filter the oil?

This sounds appealing but most restaurants around here already have one individual that gets their oil. On the other hand it sure would be nice to pick up a tank of "fuel" once in while. I'm seeing complications like not wanting to give up any interior space in my medium size bus or even smelling those tanks. I'm sure there are sacrifices for some free fuel.

Gentlemen, thanks for the info. It's always enlightening.

keiffith 03-01-2016 01:25 PM

Centrifuge filters are the best.
the easiest way to get solids out is to let the WVO sit for a month or 2.

Tango 03-01-2016 02:26 PM

BTW...the same article listed over the counter "Bio-Diesel" as having the same problem with water content (?).

Robin97396 03-01-2016 03:10 PM

Wow, that is a whole bunch of new information to consider. Beyond applications on older motorcycles I wasn't aware that this type of filtering system was used.

This opens up a possibility for that old carrot juicer I've been hanging onto.

More seriously I think the black diesel option would be best if you had a 275 gallon fuel oil tank strapped in the bus, as gas station waste oil tanks are usually several hundred gallons. One good hit at a gas station could pretty much get you across the country. That's cheap even if you pay for it at a rate equal to recycling companies.

30 years ago gas stations would pay 50 cents per gallon to have waste oil removed from their holding tanks, but I don't remember anyone using it for anything more than heating oil for their shops. It's probably sold back to recyclers now, much like VO being reclaimed by the sellers at restaurants.

Thanks again. There's always something new to learn. I like this idea better than messing around with solar panels and battery banks. I found Centrifuge for Dummies at Gravity Cent. Comparison |
Seemed fitting in my case.

Tango 03-01-2016 03:15 PM

One more option...recycling used transmission fluid. Big rig autos dump huge amounts when changed and the only thing required is filtering (10 micron I am told).

Robin97396 03-01-2016 04:12 PM

Yes apparently tranny fluid is the preferred juice for fuel, and tranny fluid is actually very cleansing to your fuel system as a pint in your automotive gasoline tank cleans injectors or carburetors. There is considerable talk about mixing oils and fuels to get a better burn but that seems to be subjective to the vehicle. There are forums for specific engine models that I need to study.

Things would be so much simpler if I'd just use multifuel engine from the army truck, or better yet just use this bus body and the deuce frame so I had a 6x6 bus, I mean van. I know how to split the injector pump and make those multifuel engines go 80. Those older army 2&1/2 ton trucks got about 16 or 17 on the highway and they're set up to burn just about any petroleum product including axle grease.

That's why these buses are never finished. There's always a new angle.

Tango 03-01-2016 05:19 PM

I LOVE the deuce and a half idea...go for it!

Robin97396 03-01-2016 05:49 PM

I'd have to do some measuring and a lot of cutting. I think it would be extremely stable with the 6x6 platform. Even the 24volt problems are workable. What stops me is not wanting to use the deuce's manual transmission. I like the automatic trans, power steering and the heated mirrors a lot. I mean a lot. I have property but no shop to work in and I'm to old to do this stuff outside anymore. I would absolutely love to have a 6x6, ahem, van. I'd actually use that feature to get out of site in places where I wouldn't dare go now.

CaptSquid 03-01-2016 07:02 PM

Bugger the Deuce! I'd want a 5 ton M54 instead. And as for that underpowered Continental multi-fuel? You REALLY don't want my answer.

sdwarf36 03-01-2016 07:04 PM

My method:
Pour cubies into 55 gallon drums-let sit. (I have enough sitting it could almost be a year).
Pump from the top down -leave the bottom 10 gal or so--into another barrel-poured thru a 100 micron sock filter. Heat the barrel to 120* for 24 hours.-Then let sit 24 hours.
Pump thru household water filters -4 in series--20-10-5-1 microns into another barrel.Leave the bottom 5 gal or so. (I have a couple on wheels-and a 12v pump) Let sit at least a week before pumping into vehicle. Leave the bottom 5 gal.
I've been inside 2 motors that have been running on veg. One had less carbon than usual and the other looked just normal.
I've seen people use juicers as 'fuges-you'll make about a gallon in 2 hours. Someone on a grease forum found them cheap + had 6 running at once. And they aren't made for that long of a duty cycle. And if you do 'fuge, you still have to filter-and heat. Those little $200 ones you mount on a barrel take I think about 24 hours to do a batch. If you only run it thru once.
If you have enough water to make rust, You'll have a hell of a time just getting the stuff to burn.

Robin97396 03-01-2016 07:54 PM

Yeah, a 5 ton would be nicer for power and the newer trucks have automatics. I like the multifuel engines in both of the older trucks because of their versatility, plus that's what I worked on in the service when I was a diesel specialist. I don't mind that the power rating is about the same as this bus currently has. The thing is I have 3 deuces and no 5 ton trucks. I'm not willing to drive a 5 ton back to Oregon from southern California so I've got what they sell more locally.

sdwarf36; Yeah, I've read about rust all through your fuel system if you don't take care of the water. In the long term it would certainly be worth it to get a larger and obviously more expensive centrifuge and they take an hour to process 55 gallons. I've been trying to think of a farm boy way to process oil, but I guess that's what you're doing by letting it settle for long periods of time.
Do you remember those toilet paper oil filters people were using on their cars back in the 80s? They say those were marvelous on vehicles and you didn't have to change your engine oil because it was so clean, so I think they ought to filter hot VO under gravity feed. Then again I'm sure someone somewhere has already tried that.

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