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BusT 04-01-2019 10:28 PM

I bought my first bus
 
. I paid 6500....
The bus was in California and I flew out there to drive it back.
It cost 600$ approx in gas for 1500 miles. Some hills. I’ll mention more on that....
It maxed out at 75ish . I kept it between 60-70 most of the time .
I saw 7mpg at 65 and rpms were 2500 with a few hills.
The bus is a 2003 international amtran
Rear air bags , dt466e , Allison 2000 , handicap rear flooring no wheel wells. In rear .
Bought with 187k miles.
Bus was previously sold to the guy I bought it off , from aaa bussales in phoneix .
He told me the bus had a issue where sometimes the gauges start going back and forth.
Maybe because the way they took off the governor or rev limiter. I’m not sure . Sounds or looks like it’s a short in the instrument cluster.
When the bus does do that the odometer doesn’t count miles.
So Maybe more miles on the engiene then what it seems. Which I wasn’t aware of until driving back.
So the fuel gauge also was acting up. I ended up running out of gas on I 10 maybe 2 hours past elpaso TX .
Added my 5 gallons spare and still didn’t turnover. A cool trucker picked me and my gf up and we drove 30mi to the nearest truck stop in fort Stockton . I bought 2 extra cans for 20$ a peice .
Then we caught a ride with two other people that were headed back I-10 west . Both from Texas humble. Super nice . They felt
Bad watching me ask everybody for a ride. I put another 15 gallons of fuel and tried to start still no turnover ..... anyways I ended up finding out how to prime the air out. Phone was dying and YouTube helped a little. Started up. Good to go.

As I got closer to San Antonio about an hour or 2 away. I started having a hard time climbing steep grades. The bus would slow down to 25mph even 35 sometimes and lost its guts.
I tried taking off cruise control and that seemed to work for a while . Once I started getting a feel for the shifts and lock up torque converter I got it going back up at 45- 55 the same steep grades .
Until it finally just quit.
I couldn’t drive more then 55 for the next 350 or so miles. Any grade would slow me down to 25 or 30.
As this was happening the gauges stayed pin down towards zero .
I drove like this for a very long time . Contemplated tow or getting serviced .
I noticed the radio was now off , no power to it. The whole trip I didn’t have speakers but I think that the radio losing connection and that the trans started acting up and not shifting right could be eletrical .
130 miles till Houston and I’m only able to feather the gas pedal up to 55 on flats . Any climb I’m back down to 35 40mph.
It seemed like I wasn’t able to get the torque converter engaged or I was missing 5th gear or overdrive .
Until I suddenly felt it hit 60 and power through up
To 65mph and then I had the bus back again. And it was good the last 120 miles to go.
So
How do I fix the instrutment cluster if it acts up again. Which somehow stopped from doing it every hour a few times per hour for up to 20min out of the hour .
Could have been the reset done buy aaa as seller mentioned .
Was the trans eletrical . Check out the videos I’ll link. ? How to prevent that.

Also now noticed oil near driveway . So I’ll check on that.
Other than this I love the bus. ... kind of respect the bus. Might of paid way to much but it’s mine now

Gauges malfunction https://youtu.be/T9mL1SbDGGw

o1marc 04-01-2019 11:35 PM

Faulty circuit board gauge panels are quite common. Many buses come through here with too good to be true mileage, it usually is.:thumb:

tugboater 04-01-2019 11:57 PM

Good test drive, long enough to get to know it little. I like that length...good luck!

BusT 04-02-2019 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by o1marc (Post 317488)
Faulty circuit board gauge panels are quite common. Many buses come through here with too good to be true mileage, it usually is.:thumb:

Is there a way to plug in and check the mileage from a computer? Based off what the ecm says?
Is there a way someone could plug in and change the mileage also?
It does seem like the engine runs good but the oil pan is covered with a lot of grime. I canít tell if itís 185k or 250k

BusT 04-02-2019 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tugboater (Post 317490)
Good test drive, long enough to get to know it little. I like that length...good luck!

Yeah I feel like a pro driving it now besides on the hills and feathering the pedal to climb them at decent speed. Thanks Iíll need it !

cadillackid 04-02-2019 08:24 AM

change your fuel filters.. you ran a HEUI engine out of fuel, probably sloshed up any sediment in the tank and clogged the filters.. maybe some bad fuel?


maybe just had air bubbles working through? you get air bubbles in an injector and sometimes they take a long time to work out.. makes for a cylinder or 2 to skip and take away power..




also did the weather change from the time it started slowing down till it "picked back up?"


these newer 466E's are designed to "de-rate" if you get them hot.. so you are climbing hills in hot texas.. it gets hot and slows dowmn the max fueling ability so you dont burn it up and ruin it.. you had no gauges so who knows that the temp was..



if it cooled off in the evening or you started going down hills.. it will go back to normal fueling..



plugging into the computer and reading the 'P' screen will show the hours / mileage. as well as the last time it de-rated fue to oil pressure or over-heat.

the factory de-rate setting is 235. but many people in Hot climates set it lower as 235 is hot enough to already damage the cylinder liners.. so it couldve been set to alarm at 235 and start de-rate at 216. (thats a number ive seen in some computers)..



if you get the transmission hot.. it will go to a different shift schedule to keep the converter locked through many more ranges. and weill attempt to stay in a higher gear rather than hunt up and down.. this is designed to help cool it off..



if it is unlocked the engine will just rev, it wont ever lock the converter if the datalionk between engione and trans dies.. the gauges are on the data-bus.. so its possible a short in your gauge cluster takes down the datalink and makes the trans stay unlocked.. your bus wouldnt have as much "power" in the hills.. the engine would just stay revved to close to redline..



-Christopher

BusT 04-02-2019 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cadillackid (Post 317525)
change your fuel filters.. you ran a HEUI engine out of fuel, probably sloshed up any sediment in the tank and clogged the filters.. maybe some bad fuel?


maybe just had air bubbles working through? you get air bubbles in an injector and sometimes they take a long time to work out.. makes for a cylinder or 2 to skip and take away power..




also did the weather change from the time it started slowing down till it "picked back up?"


these newer 466E's are designed to "de-rate" if you get them hot.. so you are climbing hills in hot texas.. it gets hot and slows dowmn the max fueling ability so you dont burn it up and ruin it.. you had no gauges so who knows that the temp was..



if it cooled off in the evening or you started going down hills.. it will go back to normal fueling..



plugging into the computer and reading the 'P' screen will show the hours / mileage. as well as the last time it de-rated fue to oil pressure or over-heat.

the factory de-rate setting is 235. but many people in Hot climates set it lower as 235 is hot enough to already damage the cylinder liners.. so it couldve been set to alarm at 235 and start de-rate at 216. (thats a number ive seen in some computers)..



if you get the transmission hot.. it will go to a different shift schedule to keep the converter locked through many more ranges. and weill attempt to stay in a higher gear rather than hunt up and down.. this is designed to help cool it off..



if it is unlocked the engine will just rev, it wont ever lock the converter if the datalionk between engione and trans dies.. the gauges are on the data-bus.. so its possible a short in your gauge cluster takes down the datalink and makes the trans stay unlocked.. your bus wouldnt have as much "power" in the hills.. the engine would just stay revved to close to redline..



-Christopher


What kind of software do I need to read and or plug into the bus. Is it free? Would I need to buy a special plug or obd ?

The weather got colder as the problem happened . It mightíve been close to 50 degree either way for the most of the time trans was acting up. I wish I wouldíve recorded that. Engien temps never got above 200 even when in California and Texas was probably colder as a front had blown in.
The gauges werenít working right when trans was acting up so I canít tell if I couldíve been overheating and didnít feel like it was running to hot.
I did notice a gauge without a faceplate that would come on randomly or light up while hitting a bump that I was able to smack and turn it off. It was to the left of all my other gauges.
I do plan on checking oil levels and changing filters , maybe coolant as well. And routine stuff. Whatís really strange is after the trans was acting up and stopped I drove another 2 hours fine . With no problems . Or even the usual gauges going back and forth.

cadillackid 04-02-2019 10:21 AM

Navistar gives away a free version of ServiceMaxx J1708 that you can read codes, read mileage, change Customer parameters like cruise, speed limiters, and the likes...



you need a Nexiq USB link 2. Device or chinese knock off equivalent of said device to plug into the bus... it's connector is either a gray 6 pin round or green/gray 9 pin round.. these are called deutsch connectors and they use a different protocol than OBD-II.



some codes and such can be read with a BlueFire device and an app on your smart phone or tablet..



a scangauge D gives you access to trouble codes and some parameters as well..



if for some reason you have completely loose wiring and were losing power to the transmission.. it would run in 2nd or 3rd gear Limp mode and not run any higher than that...



if the gauge panel loses power and then regains it.. the needles all sweep to their max position, then sweep back to 0 then show their readings.. so if the needles were constantly going up and hitting their max then mion. every time you hit a pump.. its likely something loose... a common issue in these gauge clusters..

BusT 04-02-2019 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cadillackid (Post 317549)
Navistar gives away a free version of ServiceMaxx J1708 that you can read codes, read mileage, change Customer parameters like cruise, speed limiters, and the likes...



you need a Nexiq USB link 2. Device or chinese knock off equivalent of said device to plug into the bus... it's connector is either a gray 6 pin round or green/gray 9 pin round.. these are called deutsch connectors and they use a different protocol than OBD-II.



some codes and such can be read with a BlueFire device and an app on your smart phone or tablet..



a scangauge D gives you access to trouble codes and some parameters as well..



if for some reason you have completely loose wiring and were losing power to the transmission.. it would run in 2nd or 3rd gear Limp mode and not run any higher than that...



if the gauge panel loses power and then regains it.. the needles all sweep to their max position, then sweep back to 0 then show their readings.. so if the needles were constantly going up and hitting their max then mion. every time you hit a pump.. its likely something loose... a common issue in these gauge clusters..


That’s what it seemed. What’s a cheap knockoff? There on amazon for 600$+ but seemed to fakes according to the reviews . I also never got any codes popping up on dash. Maybe because the instrument cluster wasn’t working or the one light that had no gauge in front of it was a trans temp lsensor or something and just was t there
I think loose wiring . Can I download the software from Navistar website ?
With both the gauge cluster and the transmission .

What’s the fix just re solder the connections behind the gauges on the mother board ?
What about the trans to , I feel like it was in 2nd and 3rd the whole time. The take off was rough shifting and max speed would go to 55 maybe 58 then back down near 30 or under.

Also when trans started working again gauges worked ....
when trans was messed up the gauges were pinned down to 0
Most of the ride the gauge cluster was sweeping back and forth for at least 10min every hour

BusT 04-02-2019 12:41 PM

4 Attachment(s)
My trans serial number in pic
And a post about an Allison 2000 recall
My serial number is just out of a post describing an issue with tourqe converter also.. still I think it could be a wiring limp home mode issue that happend.


Also I attached pics of my rear differential . I still canít figure out the gearing.

Last pic was somehow uploaded upside down
Of rear diiferntial

cadillackid 04-02-2019 01:00 PM

this is the clone
NEXIQ-2 USB Link + Software Diesel Truck Interface support Bluetooth


this is the real one.(at least I think its real.. I got mine there and havent had a single issue out of it).



https://www.diesellaptops.com/Nexiq-...k-2-124032.htm




theres no way to know exaclty whjats causing your issue without diagnosing it...its hard for me to do without being there to see it and experience it... you can pull the flash codes right off the dashboard by turning on the key and p[ressing the diagnostic button.. if your gaige cluster is alive at the time you press the button you shou;d see tje WARN light and OIL / WATER alarm light flash out the codes for you..


Reading codes on IH electronic engines | BinderPlanet


if it reads you a zillion codes, disconnect the batteries for a bit, reconnect, driove it and pull the codes again after it has gone into failure condition.. that is kind of like a "clean slate" to seeing what codes are coming up the most active..
-Christopher

musigenesis 04-02-2019 02:33 PM

Man, I thought my first time driving my bus was stressful, and it was just two blocks from my parking space to the mechanic's shop.

musigenesis 04-02-2019 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cadillackid (Post 317525)
change your fuel filters.. you ran a HEUI engine out of fuel, probably sloshed up any sediment in the tank and clogged the filters.. maybe some bad fuel?


maybe just had air bubbles working through? you get air bubbles in an injector and sometimes they take a long time to work out.. makes for a cylinder or 2 to skip and take away power..




also did the weather change from the time it started slowing down till it "picked back up?"


these newer 466E's are designed to "de-rate" if you get them hot.. so you are climbing hills in hot texas.. it gets hot and slows dowmn the max fueling ability so you dont burn it up and ruin it.. you had no gauges so who knows that the temp was..



if it cooled off in the evening or you started going down hills.. it will go back to normal fueling..



plugging into the computer and reading the 'P' screen will show the hours / mileage. as well as the last time it de-rated fue to oil pressure or over-heat.

the factory de-rate setting is 235. but many people in Hot climates set it lower as 235 is hot enough to already damage the cylinder liners.. so it couldve been set to alarm at 235 and start de-rate at 216. (thats a number ive seen in some computers)..



if you get the transmission hot.. it will go to a different shift schedule to keep the converter locked through many more ranges. and weill attempt to stay in a higher gear rather than hunt up and down.. this is designed to help cool it off..



if it is unlocked the engine will just rev, it wont ever lock the converter if the datalionk between engione and trans dies.. the gauges are on the data-bus.. so its possible a short in your gauge cluster takes down the datalink and makes the trans stay unlocked.. your bus wouldnt have as much "power" in the hills.. the engine would just stay revved to close to redline..



-Christopher

I just wanted to say that doing the skoolie thing would be impossible without people like you sharing their knowledge of these buses. I hope you know you're appreciated by at least tens of people. :Thanx:

BusT 04-02-2019 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cadillackid (Post 317606)
this is the clone
NEXIQ-2 USB Link + Software Diesel Truck Interface support Bluetooth


this is the real one.(at least I think its real.. I got mine there and havent had a single issue out of it).



https://www.diesellaptops.com/Nexiq-...k-2-124032.htm




theres no way to know exaclty whjats causing your issue without diagnosing it...its hard for me to do without being there to see it and experience it... you can pull the flash codes right off the dashboard by turning on the key and p[ressing the diagnostic button.. if your gaige cluster is alive at the time you press the button you shou;d see tje WARN light and OIL / WATER alarm light flash out the codes for you..


Reading codes on IH electronic engines | BinderPlanet


if it reads you a zillion codes, disconnect the batteries for a bit, reconnect, driove it and pull the codes again after it has gone into failure condition.. that is kind of like a "clean slate" to seeing what codes are coming up the most active..
-Christopher


Alright Chris thanks man. Iíll report my findings. Iím going to start with getting a scanner. Maybe the knock off. Not sure. I was really impressed with the bus until the trans did that. Now Iím not confident I can move forward on anything else until resolving this .

cowlitzcoach 04-19-2019 06:15 AM

Figuring out whether or not the engine and transmission are good or not is always a good thing to discover BEFORE you invest a lot of time and $$$ into a conversion.


I would echo the suggestion that a lot of problem with power is probably due to dirty fuel filters. Diesel engines do not like to run out of fuel and if you suck off the bottom of the tank you are going to suck up a lot of crud and corruption that will foul up your fuel filters.


As for the electronic glitching, that is one of the drawbacks of the newer electronically controlled vehicles. If you are Christopher and enjoy diagnosing electrical gremlins and figuring out OEM computer coding and how to improve the parameters then electronics are not a bad thing. But for those of us troglodites who can remember 6-volt electrics with generators, 12-volt electrics with alternators is about as new tech as we want to go.


In regards to your dash going nuts, it might be something as simple as a loose ground connection somewhere that is causing your intermittent faults.



Good luck and keep us posted as to your progress.

BusT 04-19-2019 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowlitzcoach (Post 320673)
Figuring out whether or not the engine and transmission are good or not is always a good thing to discover BEFORE you invest a lot of time and $$$ into a conversion.


I would echo the suggestion that a lot of problem with power is probably due to dirty fuel filters. Diesel engines do not like to run out of fuel and if you suck off the bottom of the tank you are going to suck up a lot of crud and corruption that will foul up your fuel filters.


As for the electronic glitching, that is one of the drawbacks of the newer electronically controlled vehicles. If you are Christopher and enjoy diagnosing electrical gremlins and figuring out OEM computer coding and how to improve the parameters then electronics are not a bad thing. But for those of us troglodites who can remember 6-volt electrics with generators, 12-volt electrics with alternators is about as new tech as we want to go.


In regards to your dash going nuts, it might be something as simple as a loose ground connection somewhere that is causing your intermittent faults.



Good luck and keep us posted as to your progress.


Thanks for the input man . Iíve been kind of holding off recently on buying a scanner .
Only thing Iíve done to the bus as of lately was pressure washing the underside of the engine to remove grime and dirt to find a possible oil leak. Since then and letting it run I havenít been seeing any oil at all.
I really donít care for tinkering with electronics all that much. I did add solar to my van/ ambulance and I donít have to plug into shore power anymore to keep batteries charged. But coding is another level.
I know the trans problem was intermittent and think it could of had something to do with loose connection or the trans was reading that I was still in hills or something . Itís allsion 2000.
Iíve read that it talks to engine and can limit parameters for appropriate fuel consumption and shifting . But anyways it did correct itself after a few hundred miles .
Hopefully it doesnít happen again. Iíd like to check whatever harness I need to . And get that solved. Also need to order new filters ASAP.
The last thing I want to do is throw money on it or into a conversion and find out I have serious issues but I doubt the issues are anything mechanical .
Iíve researched that in order to fix the gauge cluster itís just re soldering connections going to the gauge wiring harness. And from there Iíll start diagnosing any wires going to trans . And replace filter and fluids.
Also Iíve been thinking of cutting exhaust to exit in front of driver side rear wheels to allow for under body space in back of the bus.
And instead of replacing gauges I might just try to get a digital display.
Also have been slowly removing screws in floor and ceiling to make the demo go faster once bus is in permanent location for conversion.
And Iíve been holding off on taking off factory Ac system because I would like to have dash heat for defrost and cooling in the front then probalay run a mini split off sold with ducting and vents so I could have independent system for central Ac.
.........
Also. Hahah I need a class b non commercial license to drive here in Texas .
Even the though I know the bus Dosent weight but 20,000 pounds now . The gvwr Is 30,000 and Iíd like to dispute that although the manufactures weight rating is above 26,000 the conversion I plan on doing while fully loaded wonít be required to have a class b .
So I need the 4 out of 6 or 7 items .
Some insurance and take my written and driving test . And some have said will might be rested for the air brakes . Including leakes . And how fast it depressurizes in a minute . On top
Of that I need weight certificate and inspection .

Hereís my 2/3 week update.

HazMatt 04-19-2019 01:15 PM

Do like I done, to change my title to MH here in Da Lone Star: take it to a certified scale, and submit (A copy of) the ticket to the appropriate authority.

BusT 04-19-2019 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haz.matt.1960 (Post 320755)
Do like I done, to change my title to MH here in Da Lone Star: take it to a certified scale, and submit (A copy of) the ticket to the appropriate authority.

So your bus has air breaks and was over 26,000 pounds to start with. But you got a ticket of your weight and donít need non commercial class b now?

HazMatt 04-19-2019 08:40 PM

Well... no. Kinda figgered you might check my specs, first...

Stripped weight was HUGELY below manufacturer's guesstimation.
Quote:

Originally Posted by BusT (Post 320796)
So your bus has air breaks and was over 26,000 pounds to start with. But you got a ticket of your weight and donít need non commercial class b now?

However: if yer rig's stripped weight is demonstrably below DOT (DPS... Whateva...) standards, you might score a skip, is all I was offering...

Nope: totally generic IH, here.

It would totally mean Depends, if I required 'air' brakes.

Just sayin'...

BusT 04-19-2019 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by haz.matt.1960 (Post 320811)
Well... no. Kinda figgered you might check my specs, first...

Stripped weight was HUGELY below manufacturer's guesstimation.However: if yer rig's stripped weight is demonstrably below DOT (DPS... Whateva...) standards, you might score a skip, is all I was offering...

Nope: totally generic IH, here.

It would totally mean Depends, if I required 'air' brakes.

Just sayin'...

Yeah man so I had to find a thread of yours dasss boss to get your specs
Hahah
you got the 7.3 with hydraulic brakes . Pretty cool. I hope that I could get a skip if I do weigh it and itís below like 15,000 or even 20,000. From the 26,000 rule .
The only thing Iím wondering is if theyíll see I got airbreaks and require the airbreak license .
Yeah Iíve been thinking of getting a pardon if I could.


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