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-   -   Pros/cons of van style shorty vs dog nose shorty (https://www.skoolie.net/forums/f13/pros-cons-of-van-style-shorty-vs-dog-nose-shorty-27448.html)

JoeNesquik 06-10-2019 09:19 PM

Pros/cons of van style shorty vs dog nose shorty
 
Ya know, the Ford/Chevy van ones where the front part is a regular van? Dog nose as in like a full size bus, but short. NOT a van cutaway.

peteg59 06-10-2019 09:39 PM

Interior space and carrying capacity are the 2 biggies. Obviously the van is smaller and has less weight carrying or towing capacity than a diesel dog nosed shorty.

Many other differences come into play when selecting the right vehicle that meets your needs. Plenty of great info on here regarding both types if you search it out.

I like the gas power of the van cutaway and ease of finding parts and garages to work on it.
On the flip side, with a diesel powered bus, the added issues of trying to find somewhere to get parts and fixed IF a breakdown were to occur out on the open road far away from my home shop outweigh any of the benefits found in a diesel.
The use of the internet is making parts locating faster and easier while sitting on the side of a hiway somewhere, but if something heavy needs to be shipped by truck vs UPS/Fedex be prepared to shell out some $$ and extend your wait wherever that might be. Towing also might come into play.

If you are able to work on either/both variants, the above points are basically moot.
Good luck in your search...

JoeNesquik 06-10-2019 09:40 PM

Thanks for that, what’s moot?

Danjo 06-10-2019 09:48 PM

Cutaway pros

I don’t know if this is entirely true, but none of the “grocery getter” transmissions like the Allison 545 to worry about. Every “big” little bus I found had that transmission.

Better fuel economy

In California, staying below 14001 GVWR, gets around the particulate filter rules without having to change the title to MH

Cutaway cons:

Getting to the engine to work on it. Expect to take the whole thing apart to work on it. This is a big con!

JoeNesquik 06-10-2019 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danjo (Post 331305)
Cutaway pros

I don’t know if this is entirely true, but none of the “grocery getter” transmissions like the Allison 545 to worry about. Every “big” little bus I found had that transmission.

Better fuel economy

In California, staying below 14001 GVWR, gets around the particulate filter rules without having to change the title to MH

Cutaway cons:

Getting to the engine to work on it. Expect to take the whole thing apart to work on it. This is a big con!



Forgive my stupidity, what is a grocery getter transmission?

peteg59 06-10-2019 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNesquik (Post 331303)
Thanks for that, what’s moot?

Just a fancy word for never mind what was just said.:wink1:

JoeNesquik 06-10-2019 09:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peteg59 (Post 331309)
Just a fancy word for never mind what was just said.:wink1:



Thanks. Im bad at phrases with stuff like that too

HazMatt 06-10-2019 09:59 PM

That what a cow asks when she doesn't understand. [emoji849]
Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNesquik (Post 331303)
Thanks for that, what’s moot?

Not adept at freeway travel, works better at town speeds.
Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNesquik (Post 331308)
Forgive my stupidity, what is a grocery getter transmission?

The only stupid question is the one unasked...

Danjo 06-10-2019 10:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNesquik (Post 331308)
Forgive my stupidity, what is a grocery getter transmission?

That’s a tongue in cheek commentary on that transmission that has no lockout/overdrive so not good in the mountains. The kind, more experienced people on this site turned me on to that info

JoeNesquik 06-10-2019 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danjo (Post 331317)
That’s a tongue in cheek commentary on that transmission that has no lockout/overdrive so not good in the mountains. The kind, more experienced people on this site turned me on to that info



Oh. Would it make it through without damage or would it get destroyed in hills?

Danjo 06-10-2019 10:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNesquik (Post 331319)
Oh. Would it make it through without damage or would it get destroyed in hills?

Transmission not much good to slow you down on the downhills. Search on AT 545. Maybe just typing that will make someone chime in

JoeNesquik 06-10-2019 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Danjo (Post 331327)
Transmission not much good to slow you down on the downhills. Search on AT 545. Maybe just typing that will make someone chime in



Would a jake break still be effective?

Danjo 06-10-2019 11:08 PM

You should take my “grocery getter” comment lightly although listening to others on this site had me out looking at tranny swaps.

The bus with a cowl is far superior maintence-wise.

They have higher clearances and likely more space in the “basement” than a cutaway.

They have heavier suspensions so you can carry more.

They will likely have more headroom, but that varies from bus to bus.

Danjo 06-11-2019 12:50 AM

I did a bunch of looking and I was convinced that a 7 window International was the bus for me. I almost bought one too. I missed the one I wanted by a day. The thing that ultimately made me choose the cutaway was the GVWR and the CARB rule.

I’m still happy with my purchase though. I got a low mileage, rust-free bus that was very well maintained and despite a couple initial issues (needing new batteries and to be opened up to clear the turbo) I am happy with the shorty. Sure wish I had that couple extra feet...

EastCoastCB 06-11-2019 05:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JoeNesquik (Post 331329)
Would a jake break still be effective?

School buses don't typically have them.

joeblack5 06-11-2019 09:05 AM

Unless you have some real desire for interior space a van based bus is much handier and less expensive in all other aspects.
The ground clearance issues seem to be very unlikely because where you would need ground clearance a " normal" bus can not go in the first place. In the event that you will get stuck with a truck based bus the average off road jeeper can not help you because you are to heavy. The power to weight ratio in a van style is much better...top speed is better..fuel mpg is better...parts are cheaper..tires are cheaper...
Depending on you taste looks might be in question.

Willie_McCoy 06-11-2019 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joeblack5 (Post 331362)
In the event that you will get stuck with a truck based bus the average off road jeeper can not help you because you are to heavy.

Traction and gearing can work miracles.

I once pulled out a mostly loaded bulk oil delivery truck that was stuck in the mud (not buried to the frame, but covering the rubber on the rears) with my 05' Jeep TJ Rubicon. Extra low gearing in the 6-speed, t-case and axles and decent traction made her quite the mighty mouse. :dance::dance:

PNW_Steve 06-11-2019 01:56 PM

If it has already been mentioned I missed it...

Full size CE buses are MUCH easier to work on than cutaways.

I bought a 5 window E450 Thomas and was going to make it my daily driver. Then I had to work on it.......

Now it's gone and I am looking for a full size 5 window.

Sleddgracer 06-11-2019 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PNW_Steve (Post 331425)
If it has already been mentioned I missed it...

Full size CE buses are MUCH easier to work on than cutaways.

I bought a 5 window E450 Thomas and was going to make it my daily driver. Then I had to work on it.......

Now it's gone and I am looking for a full size 5 window.

I have a nice 26' chevy motor home sitting in my driveway - price quoted from the only guy willing to quote was $3000 to r&r the motor, and I would supply the new motor - cutaways are a bitch to work on - the motorhome is being used as a spare bedroom now

Danjo 06-11-2019 03:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PNW_Steve (Post 331425)
If it has already been mentioned I missed it...

Full size CE buses are MUCH easier to work on than cutaways.

I bought a 5 window E450 Thomas and was going to make it my daily driver. Then I had to work on it.......

Now it's gone and I am looking for a full size 5 window.

Yeah, NO ONE likes to work on them. I’m hoping good maintenance keeps mine on the road for a long time. I gotta say though, that pneumatic tools make it a lot less painful when it does happen.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JxVa1zQLN1g


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