A nICE Bus - Blue Bird CS RE 3904 - Full-Time Home

[Busjamin]

this cannot be done continuously throughout the floor

Correct. It will be more like 1/3 of the overall floor area, specifically between the axles on either side of the frame rails. Kitchen will be built up over the frame rails like a center island.

Also you'll be cutting into an important substructure

I've got maybe 2000' of assorted lineal steel in stock and a TIG torch. What I don't have yet is a view of the floor structure. Once I have the subfloor out I can draw something up and run it past an engineer.

 

[Busjamin]

Not sure what IRL means, but cute pup. Mine go everywhere they are allowed to go with me.

IRL is "In Real Life" so I was basically indicating I was quite tired.

It's her bus, tbh.

 

[Busjamin]

Preliminary Layout

Here's a conceptual overlay of the dropped floor area.

Not shown:

• Frame Rails
• Insulation layers
• Drain runs & slope

__________

The floorplan could be laid out as such. The area shaded purple is the available space for the future dropped floor. The red bar across the center is the existing frame rail enclosure underneath the current floor. Storage spaces will be assigned once I've nailed down the critical path stuff.

__________

I'm taking a sort of hybrid approach between a professional project manager and a total neanderthal. Due to the variation is chassis design between buses, there was only so much forward planning I was able to do while shopping. I feel pretty good about where we're going but I'm sure things will change as I dive deeper into the project.

 

[Busjamin]

More demo today. Got the remainder of the toilet enclosure out and palletized that whole assembly to be purified in a big bonfire at some point. Pulled up more of the subfloor. Took one section of the window bars down (the rest will stay up as construction protection as long as possible).

I can see Russia from my bus!

 

[Kentucky Dreaming]

More demo today. Got the remainder of the toilet enclosure out. Took one section of the window bars down. Pulled up more of the subfloor.

Gonna miss the window bars. They make me feel at home.

 

[nikitis]

Thanks for the visual on where you plan to do the dropped floor.

But question for you, are there not gonna be 2 C-Channels in the way? Or do you plan to build around them?

 

[Busjamin]

are there not gonna be 2 C-Channels in the way? Or do you plan to build around them?

If you're referring to the frame rails, yes I plan to simply build around them.

Here's the underside of the floor in the storage bays:

The frame of the floor itself is fully enclosed. You can see the frame rails are enclosed as well across the center there. Most don't tear out the sheet metal of their floor, so referencing other builds on this platform hasn't been much help in seeing the true structure, or any accessories or utilities that may run through there. No doubt it will require significant restructuring. Still far less than a roof-raise, albeit with less benefit.

To shore things up while underway, I'll build a cover that can be secured in place over the dropped areas. I'll make it like a car door with bushings so it adds strength back into overall floor. This way, we can chuck whatever loose items like outdoor furniture down there whenever we decide to relocate.

Once I get this absolutely jam-packed 5x12 storage unit cleared out this Wednesday using the now-empty bus, I can get a little more liberal with the wrenching and cutting. There are also a lot of tools in there that I could really use, like a nice laser-level.

 

[Mr P]

. Most don't tear out the sheet metal of their floor, so referencing other builds on this platform hasn't been much help in seeing the true structure,

I can't speak for any other bus.....but my bus and two dump trucks are all "the same", with two massive frame rails running front to back, then structure running across them (channel shaped) that supports the floor and walls. Any under body structure hangs from the floor. At least on the three things I own.

If I were to "tear out the sheet metal" of my floor, I would have nothing holding up the sides and top of the bus. Or any underbody boxes, like my battery box.

Either you have structure resting on top of the frame, or it hangs under it.

 

[Busjamin]

 

[Busjamin]

...and a simple concept of how it might work:

 

[Busjamin]

More concept below. Working through it.

I was playing with the 32" prefab shower as a reliable and relatively cheap & simple solution.

I just can't stomach cheaping out on the one area of the build I should be an actual pro... I'm going to do a larger room with floor-to ceiling waterproofing and if feasible, a curbless shower.

As for plumbing this setup...Relative shower and toilet position makes sense to me to keep everything nice and contained in this area. It allows for some shower drain run "backwards" under the pan to the gray tank just behind the front passenger wheel well.

Toilet could be directly above the gray tank with a urine diverter draining there, so naturally positioned on the opposite side of the room. Vanity can go between, giving a convenient excuse to delete the window behind it. The fresh tank can occupy the aft portion of that existing storage bay, directly under the shower.

With both the fresh and gray tanks on the starboard side, I'll have to keep the weight balance in mind if I ever take the generator out of the bay on the opposite side.

 

[nikitis]

Your concept art is great btw. Your layout will likely be a first here. Props for trying something new.

It would seem like it would be problemsome walking by a chair all the time. You'd have to have one lowered walkway freed up at all times or climb over the chair anytime you want to get to the back. I get why you'd want to have plumbing all together like that but that will come at a sacrifice of mobility within the structure.

perhaps you could design the kitchen island so the chair is on the otherside by the fridge, and leaving the other walk way free. So reverse the sink, oven etc.

 

[Busjamin]

climb over the chair anytime you want to get to the back.

A valid concern and one I have considered.

The frame rail enclosure will have a void underneath, as if there were no toekick and you could roll a marble under your kitchen island. The casters on your typical drafting chair could slip under there. As long as we leave a void for the seat to push in, getting past should be less obnoxious.

A knock-on benefit of this is that we can extend the countertop overhang a bit more and claim more countertop area.

 

[Busjamin]

Your layout will likely be a first here.

You're one of the most active participants in this forum so this is actually super useful input LOL I am inclined to believe you.

I have been trying to find another drop floor project to no avail. I find it hard to believe someone has not done something similar before...maybe I'm just really exceptionally dumb.

 

[Mr P]

What is the load path from the bottom of the floor to the frame rail?

 

[nikitis]

In his latest drawing he actually has the C-Channels going through the kitchen island. But so far there isn't much of a load path except through the front and back of the bus connecting to the sides of the bus. So the floor will only be held up by any welds or bolted frame of the storage compartment on the sides, which may be suitable enough to carry their weight plus chair as they walk through. Might be good to add a little extra reinforcement though from the C-Channel island down to the below floor frame so it won't feel as flimsy.

I have a feeling it would work but feel flimsy as the storage compartments are usually just welded on by a few angle iron pieces and in this case the floor supports are removed in the middle at least. If it were me doing it, I'd add some center square tubing welds from island to floor for additional stability and tie the C Channels to the floor better in the center. The side walls on the sides of the bus will likely handle the weight okay on the sides but also wouldn't hurt to add some square tubing angles in the frame on the side walls to make it impossible to snap and much stronger.

 

[Mr P]

In his latest drawing he actually has the C-Channels going through the kitchen island. But so far there isn't much of a load path except through the front and back of the bus connecting to the sides of the bus. So the floor will only be held up by any welds or bolted frame of the storage compartment on the sides, which may be suitable enough to carry their weight plus chair as they walk through.

On my bus and my trucks, the frame holds up the floor which holds up the sides which holds the roof, and any under body boxes are hanging from the floor. If my floor is cut out, and actually IS cut out for the wheelchair lift, there is no support for that section of side. For the 42" of floor that's cut out of my bus, there are large supports bolted to the frame rail that extend to the side of the bus on each end of that cut out section.

The floor in the drawings above is hanging from a side (of the bus) that is no longer supported. It's a lot like sitting in a chair that your hands are holding up.

 

[ewo1]

Oh yeah and to correct the initial post, the transmission is an Allison B400. Buh-buh BEE as in Bravo 400. And, to the dealer's credit, it is at least still part of Allison's "3000 series".

I haven't read up enough on it yet to really say, but I believe it comes with more beef. Maybe that's what the B is for.

View attachment 1114608

A welcoming gift...

Allison 4000 Troubleshooting Manual - 2005- TS3989EN

Allison B Series - Mechanic tips

TS2973EN-Allison Troubleshooting manual - 2005

 

[Busjamin]

Finally got around to dismantling and palletizing all the seats.

Lots of random baggies stuffed into them. After years crushed into a crevice, they all looked like they contained drugs at some point...but they all pretty clearly just had food in them. Trail mix. Something with sauce on it. They were mostly the same kind of baggie. Could be what was handed to detainees as they boarded for a long ride. Lots of candy wrappers, tissues, folded up ICE docs, a few hand-written notes, etc.

I find myself saddened by these artifacts of the past passengers on this bus; many of which were probably having the worst day of their life...

 

[nikitis]

On my bus and my trucks, the frame holds up the floor which holds up the sides which holds the roof, and any under body boxes are hanging from the floor. If my floor is cut out, and actually IS cut out for the wheelchair lift, there is no support for that section of side. For the 42" of floor that's cut out of my bus, there are large supports bolted to the frame rail that extend to the side of the bus on each end of that cut out section.

The floor in the drawings above is hanging from a side (of the bus) that is no longer supported. It's a lot like sitting in a chair that your hands are holding up.

His will still be held up by the Frame Rails, and floor. He's not cutting the middle out of the whole bus. Only the center So the floor on both ends of the drop front and back will still have his floor, and his floor will connect to the sidewall tubing at the bottom of where the chair rails are supposed to be. The tubing that the chair rail is latched onto will add the support he needs on the sides, but he's putting all of his weight onto storage compartment areas which may not be as reinforced which is why I was suggesting adding some additional support tubing there if you are turning it into a walkway.

I don't know about your bus but on my bus I have square tubing lining the sidewalls below the floor up to the chair rails and hat channels at the floor level, so there is some sidewall support, just not much. Maybe yours doesn't? The Mid-90's buses do.

Illustrated pic here. This is how they have tubing on the sides.