Air Pressure Beep Disable Modification.

[nikitis]

I already know for starting this thread I'm going to get a lot of flack for mentioning such a thread so I'll stop you ahead of time and mention the dangers in this first post.

The point of it is so that we can learn how our buses work. I believe in freedom and in your ability to make responsible decisions.

Not all beepers/buzzers are alike on all buses, so if you've done this mod, please feel free to post in this thread pictures of what you've done.

WARNING!!!: Do not do this mod if you are the kind of person who may "Forget" items in a checklist occasionally etc. Your life, but more importantly other lives may be forfeit if you ignore this warning. There can be no room for error if you do this mod. Consider yourselves warned and I nor anyone here will be held responsible for your irresponsible decisions and you take full responsibility for continuing.

What is the mod?
The mod is to add a rocker switch that can disable Air Pressure Beeper/Buzzer Warning sounds while you do diagnoses, modification, repairs, etc, but NOT while driving. The switch will also include a RED LIGHT INDICATOR to be installed and added to also give people a visual indicator as a backup in case you do forget to turn it back on before you drive, but again if you do forget even once, you shouldn't do this mod. Regarding the beeper/buzzer, YOU NEED THIS WHILE DRIVING. This is required because you need to audibly hear noise should your brakes begin to fail while driving and to buy you a few more brake pumps before you lose air completely. This can cause wrecks, deaths for you and others. The point of this mod is not to disable while driving, but while working on the bus while parked.

Reasons for doing this:
This thread is to document my experiences and others experiences for my bus model and others buses as well to be able to disable the Air pressure warning beep/buzzer when you want to work on "Other" electrical items and require a "Key ON" event.

When you need to concentrate on ECM values in ServiceMaxx or NavCal or fixing light wiring and testing etc, you don't need that buzzing or beeping directly in your ear. This is more than a mere annoyance for some. We literally cannot concentrate, and I'm sure i'm going deaf quickly buy entertaining it. We don't need air pressure warnings when doing such activities.

Additionally, most of us are adults and should be capable of following proceedures before driving a bus. If you aren't you shouldn't be driving a bus, but if you can't always do your checklists 100%, do not do this modification. I believe everyone should have knowledge, and knowing how your bus works is one of the fundamental requirements of our movement, and it should include how this item works. My hope is that you'll know better how to service it, replace it should it be dying, or possibly change the tone so it's audible but not so loud, they do make softer tone versions of these you can replace yours with that still serve it's purpose.

Tomorrow I will try to locate my beeper in my bus. I know it's near the dash, likely behind the rocker panel, but I've noticed that when my head is below my dash's hood, it's louder than when I'm above it. I'm usually below when working on ECM issues as my 6-port J1708 jack is under the dash to the far left wall on my bus, not in the middle where it's as easy to access like on newer buses.

 

[s2mikon]

Any reason why the manufacture didn't do this?

 

[cadillackid]

why not just pull out the "gauges" fuse while you are working???

 

[nikitis]

why not just pull out the "gauges" fuse while you are working???

Well for the uninitiated, it would be nice to know a few things like:

A.) That there was even a fuse for it that can be pulled.
B.) Location of said fuse.
C.) Location of beeper/buzzer. Is it in the gauge cluster or in the buses main circuit box?
We know some buses it's 2 little black boxes in the main circuit box.
D.) Are there differences in location of beeper/buzzers on varying model buses?

There's a lot of unknowns and it's not as simple in our minds if we've never messed with it.
Some people have mentioned they are tone def and cannot pinpoint where the beeper is without a mechanics stethoscope which non mechanics may not have access to.

 

[nikitis]

Any reason why the manufacture didn't do this?

Legalities likely. Don't want to get sued when the one person disables it with a rocker switch, forgets to turn it on, and brakes fail, and someone dies. Also legally it requires an audible tone with exception of the deaf then a visual indicator can be used. However the law doesn't want a visual only indicator, they want it permanently enabled which I disagree with. It only needs to be enabled while driving. There needs to be capability to turn it off when not driving and are diagnosing your vehicle for other matters. The government thinks you are incapable of turning it back on.

The reason I suggest adding a visual indicator as a modification is so that you don't start the bus and forget to turn the audible buzzer back on before driving.

 

[ewo1]

Why dont you just start the engine and fill up the air tanks?

Problem solved !

And if you lose air quickly, you got bigger problems!

 

[s2mikon]

I'm with ewo1. Mine is real easy to disable and I won't do it. Just 1 brain fart and the mortician made his house payment. This sounds like a solution in search of a problem.

 

[nikitis]

Why dont you just start the engine and fill up the air tanks?

Problem solved !

And if you lose air quickly, you got bigger problems!

Sorry, no. This is unacceptable. I also don't want to further wear out my bus by having to start the engine, and wait 5 mins for the tanks to fill, wearing out tanks, introducing more water to further rust the tanks, wearing out seals, hoses etc, and engine glow plugs, other engine parts, warming it up expanding and contracting its core from temporary heat, wearing out my already 30 year old air compressor. I tend to find myself going in and out of my bus to work on different things, and i'll lose air pressure in between and the beeper will be back on again. It's a lot of wear and tear that could simply be handled by a flip of a rocker switch. It doesn't make logical sense to do all of that when it can logically be solved with the flick of a switch electrically which brings no wear and tear on the bus.

My experience has been like so to give you an example:
I enter the bus, I go to fix my strobe light, switch isn't working, Key On, Beeper ensues blasting away at my ears. I go to the back to multi meter test the wiring for voltage while the switch is on, still beeping, forgot my multi-meter in the workshop at my other property. Get phone reminder that a scheduled work call is about to happen. Walk away from bus. Come back hours later, if I had filled up my air tanks, they would now be drained by this time. I have multi meter in hand now hours later, key on, switch on, ear drums getting battered again.

Other examples are when using servicemaxx to test values etc. It's extremely annoying, and none of these tests require an air brake system, I want it off. I shouldn't have to needlessly wear out my air system prematurely and engine everytime I want to do a diagnosis or fix as there will be a lot of these sessions, Period, end of story.

The point isn't to diagnose the air system, it's about disabling the beeper/buzzer while working on OTHER items than the air brake system, like programming ECM, or adding peripherials, double din stereo systems, speakers, fixes, repairs, etc.

You do not want that noise directly piercing your ear drums while you are concentrating on fixing your bus, and the Key is in the ON position.

If my bus were new and in service on a school yard, I'm likely as a school district bus mechanic am probably only going to ever work on one item, fix it and move on. It may not be as much of a nuisance. But our buses are old, they have a lot of issues, and I'm in there a lot diagnosing and learning and testing. I literally can't stand it and it's driving up the wall. It has bothered others as well in the skoolie community as there are threads all over this place stating such.

I also believe some beepers are louder than others. Mine is insanely loud. I've been in other buses where it's a soft beep and it's not as much of an issue. I've also seen one where it sounds like a 7/11 gas station with calm door chimes. This is NOT the case with me. It hurts my ears like a dog whistle hurts a dogs ears. It's painful.

Adding a rocker switch to disable the beeper/buzzer is a noble upgrade and it makes the most sense to do. I'm going to add a softer beeper as well. So we're gonna do it, and this thread will be instructional.

 

[jimmythomas]

Why not just run up the air pressure?
The warning is there for a reason.
You can just hook the bus up to a shop air compressor to fill the tanks.
I like the door warnings too. Years ago I almost lost a dog out the back door of a 1958 Chevy bus, and the warning buzzer would have prevented that.

 

[nikitis]

Why not just run up the air pressure?
The warning is there for a reason.
You can just hook the bus up to a shop air compressor to fill the tanks.
I like the door warnings too. Years ago I almost lost a dog out the back door of a 1958 Chevy bus, and the warning buzzer would have prevented that.

Well sadly outside of my buses air compressor setup, I only have a measly 6 gallon pancake compressor which would burn out trying to fill up all the tank volume in the bus. And not everyone has access to shop compressors. Those who live in their skoolies definitely do not have access to shop compressors while on the road. This could be an option if you modified your air system to have an alternative intake port which wouldn't be terrible to do, but to me it seems far more logical and easier and less work to just add a rocker switch to disable the beeper temporarily.

Plus if you overfill something in doing so in a part of your buses air system you could cause an even more dangerous situation potentially if you pop something or overpressurize something. I'd far less trust myself doing that than adding a rocker switch to disable the beeper/buzzer

 

[BamaBus]

Civil lawsuits will happen for just about anything. Check and see if the local DA office can attempt to prove criminal negligence from tampering with a designed safety system.

 

[ewo1]

Other examples are when using servicemaxx to test values etc. It's extremely annoying, and none of these tests require an air brake system, I want it off. I shouldn't have to needlessly wear out my air system prematurely and engine everytime I want to do a diagnosis or fix as there will be a lot of these sessions, Period, end of story.

The point isn't to diagnose the air system, it's about disabling the beeper/buzzer while working on OTHER items than the air brake system, like programming ECM, or adding peripherials, double din stereo systems, speakers, fixes, repairs, etc.l.

That was a well thought out explanation and justification, for a one off scenario.

I have experienced that engine must be at operating temp when doing certain testing thru servicemaxx, so there goes that.

The real scary part is…shortcutting life safety systems because “it’s annoying”.
Or, what if one day you did not realize it was off and you blew an air line…

Convenience is nice but safety is always first.

Everything about installing peripherals, thats all done with key off, if you know what your doing. Key on to test your install, yes.

I understand what your doing and see that you have prepared for the feedback so… carrry on !

 

[nikitis]

Here is a simple wiring diagram for the modification. Subject to change, and likely to.

So when you turn off the beeper, you'll have a RED Light which will be installed on the dash in front of you so you can't miss turning it back on before driving.

There, it's still safe.

Added bonus. If someone is hearing impaired, this mod will work as a visual indicator as well for them, and will auto shut off when the PSI hits over 60 PSI, and the light will come on if it goes under, if left in the Rocker OFF position.

 

[nikitis]

Civil lawsuits will happen for just about anything. Check and see if the local DA office can attempt to prove criminal negligence from tampering with a designed safety system.

I'll just argue I made it more safe by Adding a visual indicator for the hearing impaired, and also a dash reminder to re-enable it when not doing diagnostics.

Besides there's also legal precedence about stifling American innovation if you know to use it in court. Existing setups cannot be used to stifle Innovation. Which was specifically been used in the past for automotive use.

 

[s2mikon]

Plaintiff's Lawyer: Did you or did you not modify in any way your brake warning system? Defendant: I made it safer. Judge: Just answer the question. Plaintiff's Lawyer: Did you or did you not modify in any way your brake warning system? Defendant: Yes. Plaintiff's Lawyer: No further questions your Honor.

 

[cadillackid]

sorry but im just not onboard with this.. anyone doing this gets the darwin award for the year...

 

[fo4imtippin]

I'm of the mind not to mess with the ECU more often than necessary. That said, I have a 12v air compressor plumbed to my air system. Flick of a rocker switch and I'm fully aired up.

 

[Kentucky Dreaming]

Just 1 brain fart and the mortician made his house payment. This sounds like a solution in search of a problem.

I concur. It would be an easy 12-0 jury verdict.

 

[Ronnie-SKO]

Old trucks used a red flag above the windshield that drops down when air is low. You have to manually put it back up once aired back up. I want to get one for my old bus, it would be period correct and legal. Best of all no buzzer.

 

[nikitis]

Well I'm sorry you guys feel that way.

I'm not going to shy away from learning something about how my bus works. I don't believe within the bounds I've set that it's dangerous, I just don't. I've already given disclaimer to would be followers who wish to do the same thing, but the difference is, I'm not trying to stop them from learning.

If you can't see a bright red light on your dash labled "air pressure buzzer disabled" and you choose to ignore it, then no one can help you anyway. You'll ignore the audible sound as well in that case. I've put a disclaimer and I'm not responsible for anyone's actions. I'm in the pursuit of knowledge, and I allow everyone else to have their agency and make their own decisions like grown ups do.

I will carry on with this project. You've said your peace on this project I've said mine. Be responsible with the information that will be provided here.