flooring

[joshritchie]

i have old rubber for the floor in my bus but i want to put down a ply (sp ) wood flooring
i think im gonna put down 1x1 around the edge and build a frame to lay the ply wood across
is that the way to do it or not?

thanks,
josh

 

[elkoskoolie]

As long as the support spacing is adequate for the ply thickness, should be O.K.. Make sure you're not going to lose too much headroom. Also, this will give an opportunity to add some insulation, and also put in a hydronic heating system- aka radiant floor heating. I've seen a thread or so here on that subject. I think it's a bit more common in the high-end bus conversion world. Might do a search over at busnut.com. This will also give an opportunity to run wiring, water lines, etc in a clean, unobtrusive manner. Yeah, O.K. maybe I wouldn't bury the water lines like that. Do all your lay-outs and planning before you commit!! Better to do it once very well, instead of having an ugly, hastily done (but very functional) bus like mine!

A few have also mentioned pulling the original rubber flooring and putting down a floating laminate floor. In fact that's what I plan on doing when it warms up. I think you'd still want to put some kind of flooring over your plywood platform; if you're not adding insulation doing a simple change to laminate, vinyl etc. might be the faster, cheaper way to go.

Make sure there are no access panels in the floor. I think this is fairly rare except for the mid engine Gilligs and Crowns. My rear engine Gillig has a small panel over what should be the fuel tank sending unit. I think I'm going to repair/replace that BEFORE I put in the laminate flooring.

 

[SkoolieDude]

Both very good ideas. I'll list out the pros and cons of each as i see it:

1X1 method:
PROS
you can allow channels for wire/venting/water lines, etc
Its easier to attach the 1x1's to the bus frame, and then screw the subfloor (plywood) to the 1x1's, and then fasten your final floor to that
stronger
allow for radiant floor heat

CONS
the metal to wood connection would create somewhat of a thermal bridge, even with insulation in between.

Floating subfloor on rigid insulation:
PROS
superior insulating. no thermal bridges (there would still be plenty throughout the bus, but not in the floor)
simpler in a sense
CONS
to me, the major con would be connecting the subfloor to the bus body. you would want to use some sort of bolt that can be tightened pretty good, you dont want any further movement in the future as the rest of the interior will rest on this floating, moving, vibrating plate. so lets say you use something like a carriage bolt, what do you do with the large head and washer sticking up on the subfloor? that would be my reason for not doing it this way even though theoretically it would provide superior thermal insulation.



I think either way you'd want to peel up the factory rubber. On my bus the rubber was getting pretty chewed up and torn, and you need as flat a surface as you can get. How about peeling up all the old rubber and get the whole inside Rhino Lined? (or line-X, whatever you got there) you know, that spray in truck bed liner? the proceed to do whatever way you want on top of that. yeah!

 

[John-SKO]

Both very good ideas. I'll list out the pros and cons of each as i see it:

Floating subfloor on rigid insulation:
CONS
to me, the major con would be connecting the subfloor to the bus body. you would want to use some sort of bolt that can be tightened pretty good, you dont want any further movement in the future as the rest of the interior will rest on this floating, moving, vibrating plate. so lets say you use something like a carriage bolt, what do you do with the large head and washer sticking up on the subfloor? that would be my reason for not doing it this way even though theoretically it would provide superior thermal insulation.

We laid down rigid foam board then a tongue and grove advantech subfloor. The subfloor is caulked with adhesive (along the tongue) and is now a solid one piece. We didn't fasten it down, but rather just left it floating. Nailed a hickory floor down on that going orthogonal to the advantech's seam (more solidity). It's held down in places with a claw foot tub and a wood burning stove, not to mention furniture and cabinetry. Haven't seen any signs of buckling or other trouble (left a gap against the sides to allow for expansion.)

Main reason was that we wanted the thermal barrier but also didn't want to break the seal on our metal floor. We had sand-blasted the rust off, patched holes with scrap steel and POR-15'd (rust-preventative) the whole thing; it would have been a shame to put a hole in it after that.

 

[SeanF-SKO]

IMO the importance of floor insulation should not be underestimated. Unlike a house there is no slab or basement to help the situation...unless air movement is blocked somehow, it is essentially another wall. From the metal bus floor up I have: 1/2" of rigid foam insulation -> 6 mil vapor barrier -> 1/2" plywood -> oak hardwood. Right now the temperature outside is 34*F, the inside air temp is in the low 50s, the ceiling surface temp is 63, the walls around 58. and the floor is 47. Some in-floor radiant heat would be very sweet right now.

I fastened the plywood to the floor using metal screws and countersinking the holes.

 

[SkoolieDude]

Yeah, sounds like you both did your homework.I had forgotten about offsetting the final floor diagonally to the subfloor, that would definitely help with rigidity. Havent worked with advantech but it sounds hitech! But for me i would still want at least a couple fasteners all the way through. Ok, heres what i would do.. I would have say 2 rows down the length of the bus where there were 1 inch holes drilled through the rigid ins. into which i would goop a lot of either subfloor adhesive or some other hi tech super glue thats out there (there are so many types of glue its insane!), that way its adhered and wont squeak or buckle! Anyway, its good to know that people are floating it though, kinda like pergo.. You cant have too much floor insulation. When i was living out on the mesa in NM (where it gets in the negatives in the winter, with wind blowing constantly) stacked up straw bales around the bottom of the bus and halfway up the sides, it worked pretty well!

 

[Lady Franklin]

Firstly I have to comment on skoolie dudes comment,

How about peeling up all the old rubber and get the whole inside Rhino Lined? (or line-X, whatever you got there) you know, that spray in truck bed liner? the proceed to do whatever way you want on top of that. yeah!

I don't know if there is a non toxic version of this stuff but as far as I can say, I was getting pretty high on the fumes from 30 feet away let alone coating the inside of my home with the tar goop. I would most definitely not use this stuff. Call me a granola crunching hippie but its just too toxic.

skooliedude said

o me, the major con would be connecting the subfloor to the bus body. you would want to use some sort of bolt that can be tightened pretty good, you dont want any further movement in the future as the rest of the interior will rest on this floating, moving, vibrating plate. so lets say you use something like a carriage bolt, what do you do with the large head and washer sticking up on the subfloor

A tech bolt would work best for this. Its a self tapping screw designed to hold wood to metal. It has a large flat head that sucks the wood tight to the material beneath it while pulling the head just below the surface of the plywood. I used them in my floor.

I removed the rubber floor, used 5/8 ply to cover the old ply everywhere I did NOT want my water pipe to go (as in, I made little grooves everywhere) then I laid regular old tin foil over the entire floor to reflect the heat into the living space, then I pressed water pipe into the grooves which filled the grooves perfectly, then finally I covered the whole works with 1/4 ply being ever so careful to not put a screw into the pipe. And I glued the ever living crap out of the bottom layer of plywood. I also plan to use expanding spray foam to fill the floor from the bottom, this will act as my insulation and vapour barrier. Here are some pics,

Just always remember to glue all your rigid insulation, framing and plywood.