Relay for front door switch

[Whywalk]

Happy New Year!
Starting a trip from Seattle area to Arizona. The front door of my Microbird (2003 Chevy Express 3500) just randomly stopped responding to the switch, and climbing over the driver’s seat to enter & exit is getting old. I have a very talented millwright and really jack of all trades friend that I brought her to.We spent hours working on this (me, mostly being assistant because electrical stuff does NOT come easily to me).We determined the switch was not the issue, so opened up the housing above the door to get to the motor and linkage to try to locate the problem. Long long LONG story short, we narrowed the problem down to a (possibly) bad relay.
There were two identical relays and we weren’t sure which was the bad one, so I just bought two to replace them both….got to the bus, installed them….nothing.
Frustrated after an entire day of working on it, I just put the original relays back in their original slots…and the damn door works! Yay! But also, wtf?
So, the relays WEREN’T bad, and maybe the cleaning, lubrication, and motor-tapping helped…?
Then, I wonder about the relays I bought. I took an old one to NAPA for a match. The part numbers were/are different, but they assured me they were correct.
Photos of relays.
Can someone tell me:
Are these the same?
…and what’s up with the door???

 

[Whywalk]

*trying* to upload photos

 

[ewo1]

…and what’s up with the door???

There were two identical relays and we weren’t sure which was the bad one, so I just bought two to replace them both….got to the bus, installed them….nothing.
Frustrated after an entire day of working on it, I just put the original relays back in their original slots…and the damn door works! Yay! But also, wtf?
So, the relays WEREN’T bad, and maybe the cleaning, lubrication, and motor-tapping helped…?

The answer is right in front of you, broken wire inside the insulation, poor connection.

it is quite obvious in your reply/observations.....

 

[Rucker]

Yeah, probably just reseating the relays (or tapping them) took care of the issue.

If your door is a bifold and motorized, it will have a fairly complex wiring setup with two limit switches, one to turn the motor off when opening it, once it's reached its widest; and another to turn the motor off when closing it, once it's reached its closed position. While they may need adjustment over time, typically they don't need adjustments.

I don't know if I have relays in my bus door. I have a reversing switch, but the power for the door...I think is just 'normal'. Relays typically turn on and off high current systems like a/c fans.

 

[Whywalk]

]Yeah, probably just reseating the relays (or tapping them) took care of the issue.
.[/QUOTE]

That’s what I thought, too…until it stopped working again.
The door will not open via switch; I use the emergency lever attached to the linkage. When I close, I slide that lever to the right and lightly pull the door slightly closed til I feel the gear engage and then hit the close button and it’ll close.

**On a side note, Rucker, thank you for being kind with your answer! I’ve posted questions before in this (and other) forums) stating my lack of knowledge and asking for help, only to be mocked for what I don’t know. As a woman, I’m rather accustomed to that sort of response from some folks—usually men—and it’s a pleasure to have someone just answer without being snarky.
We’re all in this together. Thanks!**

 

[ewo1]

]
**On a side note, Rucker, thank you for being kind with your answer! I’ve posted questions before in this (and other) forums) stating my lack of knowledge and asking for help, only to be mocked for what I don’t know. As a woman, I’m rather accustomed to that sort of response from some folks—usually men—and it’s a pleasure to have someone just answer without being snarky.
We’re all in this together. Thanks!**

I hope you don't think I was mocking you, I wasn't.

My response was short and direct only because, for the details/actions you listed, It was quite clear for me...doing a desktop diagnosis from miles away that is....what the problem could be. a potentially broken wire inside the insulation or poor connection...and I was right...poor connection wins it for now...

Broken wires/loose connections are common in automobiles/trucks/busses....

I have had 3 broken wire events so far on my busses, all have been tranny wiring events...

 

[Whywalk]

We did not repair any wires nor see any that needed work. Also, the door quit working —at least to open—after a day. I can open it with the emergency lever, then must slightly engage emergency lever, then press the switch & it’ll close.
This has been a truly frustrating experience trying to determine a permanent fix.

 

[ewo1]

The front door of my Microbird (2003 Chevy Express 3500) just randomly stopped responding to the switch, and climbing over the driver’s seat to enter & exit is getting old.

After re-reading your post I find myself asking....are you talking about the "DRIVERS" door or the double entry door to the bus?

What is the actual problem with the door....electric door locks ???

Just trying to better understand...

...nevermind....double doors it is....

so opened up the housing above the door to get to the motor and linkage to try to locate the problem.

 

[ewo1]

Give this a try, plug in your vin number HERE in order to see if a wiring diagram is available.

 

[ewo1]

Just found your original post on this issue, back in October 2020....

https://www.skoolie.net/forums/f9/exterior-keyed-opener-for-power-door-33223.html

You gave alot more detail in that thread.... That was 4 years ago...did you ever get it to work at all since then ????

You stated in one of those posts that you found a wiring diagram...can you share it here?

Does that diagram have a diagram reference number ???

 

[Rucker]

]Yeah, probably just reseating the relays (or tapping them) took care of the issue.

That’s what I thought, too…until it stopped working again. ��
The door will not open via switch; I use the emergency lever attached to the linkage. When I close, I slide that lever to the right and lightly pull the door slightly closed til I feel the gear engage and then hit the close button and it’ll close.

Thanks for the kind words. See below for information that might apply in your troubleshooting.

So if the door is a bifold (two parts), there is connecting hardware that makes them swing in unison.

Before you reach into that compartment with all those mechanical parts you'll need to make sure power is off, and there is no chance for the switch to accidentally run the door motor. You could get seriously hurt with the door mechanicals!

Connected to that 'connecting rod' should be another rod with the linear motor (a screw shaft), which runs forward and reverse from a two way switch on your dash-that's the door opening switch.

That rod that connects the two doors and causes them to swing open or shut usually has a couple of limit switches that stop the motor, so it doesn't try to open or close the doors too far. When the rod moves back and forth the limit switches move back and forth and the switch lever is pushed up or down depending on where it is along the shaft.

My bus limit switches are a little older than yours, and they were just plain worn; so I just took them out and worked them until the switches began working again. To check and make sure they worked correctly I used an Ohm Meter that checks for continuity across the switch.

A wiring diagram might help you, but even without a diagram you should be able to test each pole of the limit switch, even without removing them or disconnecting the wires.

For instance, on my bus, I have two limit switches, and each has a whole bunch of wires connecting into perhaps five lugs on a single switch.

But the limit switch has a very specific purpose: when the little lever on the switch is up, it either opens the circuit so no voltage can flow, or it closes a circuit so that voltage can flow.

There are a couple of lugs, or poles, and there are marks on the switch next to each lug, 'NO' or 'NC'. That means 'normally open' or normally closed'. Moreover, the wires connected to those switches are color coded.

You don't necessarily need to know what the wire does to test the switch-you just need to know that when the little lever on the switch is in one position it means voltage can flow across the switch, connecting the colored wires; and when it is in the other position voltage doesn't flow.

[This is where you really need to make sure the power is off to the door and it can't be operated while you are putting your hands in that mechanism!]

The test is to push the lever up or down (depending on its current position) to see if the voltage either can flow, or no longer can flow across the two poles of the switch.

Here is one scenario. Your switch levers may operate backwards from this, but the idea is that in one position, the switch is on, and in the other, it is 'off':
lever up->NO->the lug on the other side is electrically connected so voltage can flow;
Lever down->NO->the lug on the other side is no longer connected so voltage no longer flows.

A defective switch will remain either on or off regardless of the position of the switch; and that, my friend, is going to be where your problem lies.

In my bus there are white, green and orange wires, and they all run in crazy directions across those switches. But the switch is literally turning on and off the connection for each color, so it was relatively simple for me to determine where to put the leads of the ohm meter (or continuity detector).

Let us know how you do!

 

[Whywalk]

Oops, sorry I was unclear! Yes, it’s a bifold ‘passenger’ door.